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Moon Knight

I didn't participate in off topic so all I got was this crappy title

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31

Sunday, October 11th 2015, 9:47pm

I can't fly, so I feel useless as a foot soldier on rebel side.

You probably know a lot of this, but:
  • Most power ups aren't great, but Orbital Strike is a gamer winner breaker. Pick up power ups when you can, and if you get an OS just hold on to it until the Y-Wings run.
  • Get to level 5 and unlock everything in Drop Zone before playing Walker Assault
  • Use Ion Grenade, Ion Shot, and Jet Pack as Rebels in Walker Assault.
  • There's tons of AOE, and vehicles can't target precisesly so they just shoot in the direction of clumps, so spread out to the extent possible

Hang in there; playing the Rebels is about losing with dignity.


Hope they add some kind of AA system or spawn-protection to aircraft spawning. If enemy player just realizes he can float behind enemy spawn there's no chance for spawning aircraft to beat them.

The entire spawn system needs to be reworked, along with matchmaking, partnering, and pickups. I'm hoping this beta was strictly for stress testing their Super Awesome Dedicated Servers arrangement, and they have better game play systems they're working on in the background.

Actually, I would recommend using the cycler rifle over either the ion grenade or the jump pack. The problem with the ion grenade is that chances are, you'll be long dead before you can get anywhere near vehicles. And the jump pack is only useful in a few locations on the map. The cycler rifle does significant damage to walkers, turrets, and obviously infantry. It also penetrates right through personal and deployable shields. To be quite honest, I think it needs some form of a nerf.

Spoiler Spoiler

Will it protect against STD's?

I'm a fan of the show, but not a "Brony". I don't obsess over it, but I do watch it and enjoy it.

That's like saying "I suck dick, but I'm not gay."

Fuck dubstep

MrT3a

The only man who ever reported his own post!

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32

Sunday, October 11th 2015, 9:47pm

Well, played a bit of solo mission. It hints at more cards. Maybe these would allow me to play a way I'd feel useful ^^

Will wait a bit after release to see all modes and cards.
Will probably buy it anyway ^^

How can he have the chance to get 2 OS is such a quick succession?

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I'm a battlefield player, good sir. I don't play metro.

PC is no longer PC master race. It's PC mustard race, because consoles need to ketchup :'D

DICE gave so much into making commander better, but lemmings be lemmings I guess.

As a good guy that don't want to use overly glitched weapons, I'll quit using the MTAR and switch to the ACWR until it's fixed

The world needs more people like you


+1, I think we're all in agreement that more MrT3as would be an awesome thing :love:
Although if that was the case they'd use up so much of the world's awesome that there'd be none left for the rest of us! :D

yes, I know, I'm a big-ass hypocrite

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "MrT3a" (Oct 11th 2015, 9:53pm)


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33

Sunday, October 11th 2015, 10:30pm

Just stay on the hill and it's hard for the Empire to root you out.

It's definitely an important position to hold, but can be neutralized easily. One pretty good TIE pilot will clear the hill very quickly. Or one trained ape in the AT-AT. This actually applies to all but one important position for the Rebels to hold (depending on AT-AT progression), which is half the problem with the map.

Besides, in lots of games your blueberries are over committed to "overwatch from the hill" and Rebel bodies are desperately needed elsewhere.


The cycler rifle does significant damage to walkers, turrets, and obviously infantry.

I did not know that part. I will investigate. Thank you. What else do you run? Ion Shot and Grenade? Ion Shot and Thermal?



How can he have the chance to get 2 OS is such a quick succession?

The hand of RNJesus. I've been trying to do the same thing since day two of the beta, and in 20 hours of playtime I haven't gotten a single Orbital Strike, never mind two in 20 seconds.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "symbolsix" (Oct 12th 2015, 1:40am)


Moon Knight

I didn't participate in off topic so all I got was this crappy title

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34

Tuesday, October 13th 2015, 1:58am

@symbolsix

I run Thermal det, ion shot, and cycler. Arguably, I could run ion grenade for max vehicle effectiveness, but again, I very seldom get close enough to use it.

Bear in mind, cycler cannot damage a "shielded" AT-AT. The shields must be down from a y-wing run. I think it does about 20 damage to an AT-ST.

Spoiler Spoiler

Will it protect against STD's?

I'm a fan of the show, but not a "Brony". I don't obsess over it, but I do watch it and enjoy it.

That's like saying "I suck dick, but I'm not gay."

Fuck dubstep

35

Tuesday, October 13th 2015, 7:34am

The big thing that made me uninstall the beta and decide not to buy the game was the aim assist. It's insane. My first shot was 6 feet off target and it snapped right onto him. WTF.

Also the air vehicles suck. I don't picture this game developing the kind of dogfight communities that BF3 did that's for sure.

Seems like a cool fun casual game. Not my cup of tea. Some people will love it, like the bad players who want an easy game and the good players who don't mind lowering themselves to easymode game mechanic abuse like spawn trapping and farming noobs, and the starwars fans who will snap up anything star wars. I'm not one of them. Bummed out only a little because I did see it coming.

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36

Tuesday, October 13th 2015, 5:23pm

@Moonknight

I tried the cycler rifle and just couldn't make it work; not enough DPS on AT-ST or vehicles. I'll try thermal + Ion, but I think I'm going back to Ion + Jetpack, since the Rebels *need* to be aggressive to win Walker.


Related note: I have decided that, contrary to everything we'd expect from the movies and the framing of the game mode, when you're playing Walker Assault on Hoth the Rebels are the attacking team, and must pick an assault-oriented loadout.



The big thing that made me uninstall the beta and decide not to buy the game was the aim assist. It's insane.


Was this on PC? I've gotten some very surprising long range kills in the beta, but I chalked it up to the lack of bullet gravity and negligible damage dropoff of the DLT.




I don't picture this game developing the kind of dogfight communities that BF3 did that's for sure.


> Complains about overly simplistic game mechanics
> Reminisces about Battlefield dogfighting

37

Tuesday, October 13th 2015, 9:19pm

Aim assist was on console.

Think you missed the point about the air vehicles. Yes, BF jets are simplistic. Overly so, IMO, which is why I was pro-new-jet-physics (although the implementations dice came up with, sucked, the concept was good. 313 is just kinda silly, a single velocity with optimal turn rate AND radius?? Dice do you even physics?) Despite their simplicity, they had sufficient complexity to allow for some degree of competition (read: higher skill ceiling). I don't really see that being the case with battlefront. The aircraft are on (as my friend called it) rollercoaster tracks with pushbutton maneouvring and auto-aim.

The way you typed that reply, suggests that you were attempting to invalidate my point of view, by presenting two conflicting observations, but you're actually reinforcing it, because they're not conflicting.

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38

Tuesday, October 13th 2015, 11:40pm

I'm well aware of the "skill" ceiling of jets in Battlefield, and I think Battlefront has a vastly superior take on flying. Battlefield jets sit at the apex of a pyramid balance, and have simplistic mechanics and a boring meta, but are difficult to master at a muscle memory level. I repeat: Battlefield flying has neither complexity nor depth, and focuses on twitch skills. This isn't necessarily a bad thing; we are playing a shooter, after all, and Counterstrike gun play and Star Craft micro are core features of great games and almost entirely dependent on practicing twitch gaming skills.

However, it's too early to render judgment on the Battlefront skill ceiling. Remember that missiles can be dodged without countermeasures (or even "push button" maneuvers) and you don't get a lock on direction indicator, and each ship has unique skills that must be used judiciously. If the game goes several weeks without the same sort of dominant pilots appearing in Battlefront as we have in Battlefield, I'll eat my words on this point.

Regardless of the skill ceiling, Battlefront ships are accessible and fun in a way that Battlefield jets have never been. Even in the beta, Battlefront flying had a more interesting meta than Battlefield: speeders are fucked, imperials have to worry about getting shield rammed, TIE fighters can outrun X-wings but have to rely on maneuverability to beat A-wings, A-wings can boom & zoom better than any other ship but can't make the hairpin turns TIE fighters can, etc. etc. etc.

In addition to the richer meta, the actual flying is much deeper than you give it credit for. The "pushbutton maneuvering" of the beta is strictly for dodging missiles and, perhaps, avoiding head on collisions, and I'm not certain it's even useful for those purposes. A manual Immelman turn takes less time and space than the automated one, and doesn't take control away from you. Similarly, the "auto-aim" doesn't lead correctly and won't hit anything unless you actually aim with a secondary reticle, though it is possible to get accidental hits by just wiggling the controls around (as in Battlefield). The fact that you brought either of these up at all makes me skeptical that you (or your friend) experimented enough with the flying. The only real criticism I've seen is that it makes no pretensions to be a simulation, and dispenses with thing like roll in favor of camera-relative motion. Big deal.

We can have a reasonable disagreement about which flying experience is more "fun" (again, some people like Counterstrike and StarCraft, and that's okay), but it's wrong to characterize Battlefront as "rollercoaster tracks with pushbutton maneouvring and auto-aim". Your friend was mistaken.

NoctyrneSAGA

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39

Wednesday, October 14th 2015, 12:22am

@symbolsix

That is entirely untrue.

The air meta devolved into spawncamping and the rebels getting fucked as the game went on.

The Rebels start off with X-Wings that are decent dogfighters with a shield and homing missile. They move on to the smaller A-Wing that has the same equipment. But on the last stage, they are stuck with Speeders that are not capable of inflicting any sort of appreciable damage against other air targets. They only have a shield and a locking jammer that will only prevent missiles. Smart pilots will simply use their lasers to do damage instead. Even then, it is probably better to leave the Speeder alone. Why? One less pair of boots on the ground that can potentially arm an uplink.

Meanwhile, the Empire keeps its TIE Fighter for two stages and gets the TIE interceptor for the third set. The Interceptor is like the Fighter, only it has a smaller hitbox. The Empire for the duration of the entire game retains good dogfighting capabilities. After clearing out all the aircraft in the first two sets, the Empire can just farm infantry for the third set.



The dogfight "meta" is simple: Increase sensitivity, lower speed.

Your turn rate is tied to your mouse sensitivity alone. This means that all you have to do is increase your sensitivity and you will turn quickly.

You lower your speed to reduce your turn radius to as tight as possible when dogfighting and to give you as much time as possible when strafing infantry.

The only time that you should go fast in the aircraft is if you want to dodge a missile. Other than that, all going fast serves to do is let the slow people get behind you all the time.

The button maneuvers are entirely worthless because of this. Why put your maneuver on cooldown when you can just outturn and outrace the missile by increasing your sensitivity and accelerating? This method of dodging missiles doesn't have cooldowns either. It can be used to dodge consecutive missile shots.



And let us not forget how smart flyboys caught on to how laughable aircraft dominance in this game is. It is far more convenient for pilots to ignore each other and simply farm infantry. Towards the end of the Alpha, this is exactly what happened. An unspoken and unwritten agreement to not dogfight and instead just shoot at each other's ground troops.

The tendency of the aircraft to orient themselves with the bottom to the ground and the sheer power that aircraft wield points more to a philosophy of ground attack than dogfighting.



The "meta" of SWBF is in no way superior to BF3/4's whatsoever. In fact, I would argue that it is inferior.

In BF3/4, all you need to do is move at 313 and you will be at the limit of the aircraft's dogfighting abilities. The rest is up to your ability as a pilot. At the very least, each faction's stealth jet offers a good chance at staying alive and doing damage to other aircraft.

SWBF's "meta" is even simpler (go slow and increase your sensitivity) and has the problem of being unbalanced.
Data Browser

Passive Spotting is the future!

With this, I'll rid MGO3 of infestation. Sans bad gameplay MGO3 will be torn asunder. And then it shall be free. People will suffer, of course - a phantom pain.

Reddit and Konami will rewrite the records... And I will be demonized in human memory. But... The thirst for good gameplay that I have planted will infest MGO3. No one can stop it now. The Rebalance Mod will unleash that thirst unto the future.


Are you a scrub?

If it flies, it dies.

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40

Wednesday, October 14th 2015, 12:59am

@NoctyrneSAGA

Spawn camping is something that I hope is addressed and wasn't considering; same sentiment with regard to Rebels getting only speeders in the final phase. By "meta" I was referring to the dogfighting between actual fighters on roughly even terms. If these aren't issues DICE will change, I concede that flying is terrible. OTOH, if spawn camping isn't fixed, the entire game is terrible.

Similarly, I wasn't thinking of the air to ground game, and I agree that it needs to be fixed. However, the same criticism applies to BF4; have you not seen a single monstrous pilot wreck an entire team on, say, Paracel?


I'm confused about your take on flying.

First, don't you bind movement to keyboard keys to make tight turns? I figured the best setup was to use the mouse for aiming and the keyboard for maneuvering, so I had Shift, Space, A, D bound to Up, Down, Left, Right.

Second, don't the different fighters have different flight characteristics? My impression was that it went:
Speed: TIE-F ~ A-Wing > TIE-I ~ X-Wing.
Turn rate: TIE-F > TIE-I ?? X-Wing > A-Wing
Firepower: A-Wing > X-Wing ~ TIE-I > TIE-F

I distinctly remember not being able to out turn a TIE fighter in an A-wing, and not being able to catch a running A-wing in a TIE fighter, but I guess it's possible I placebo'd myself really hard. In any case, you'll notice that I actually talked about dodging missiles without shields or button maneuvers.

Incidentally, didn't speeders have some sort of Speed ability instead of a shield? I didn't use the much because, as you said, they were terrible.