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  • "bivo" started this thread

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: Jul 5th 2016

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 3:52pm

Halo 5: Guardians

Hello everyone. Today I was watching an old levelcapgaming's video about a certain weapon and I remembered about symthic and its charts. At the same time though, I realized that I am currently spending a massive quantity of hours on Halo 5 and I have NEVER seen any graphic or any chart that talks about weapons or explain how much damage does a magnum if compared to the br or something like that. And this doesn't only affects halo 5 but also all the previous episodes...
So I was wondering why Symthic doesn't do any weapon stats chart or anything like bf4/bf3 etc...? This Halo is probably the biggest of the whole saga, it's probably one of the few games that keeps selling this freakin xbox one and it has tons of weapons and variants of them so it should be interesting to see how a weapon perform and what its variant does better.

P.s. I am sorry if i made any grammatical mistake, still improving my english :D

Miffyli

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 4:04pm

One of the first problems is the fact the game is console only, and thus files are not so easily accessible (altho apparently there is some "xbone games on win10" thing going on, but only for few games). We were able to get the actual numbers for CoD/BF from the files thus which removed all errors caused by manual testing and analysing, and provides values which would simply be borderline impossible to get via manual testing (like max spread angles or so).

Secondly the community is 95% focused on BF, and we have knowledge of the mechanics of the previous games which can be useful for the next ones. Even then, it took way too long to get all the numbers right for BF (granted BF3/BF4 had somewhat complex customization setup compared to other games).

And thirdly: We (Symthic dev team) are already almost overloaded by current workload of adding new BF games and updating the other games. We used to have more time back during BF4 release, but things have changed during these years. However somebody could take the cheap way out and post the stats on a forum topic instead of creating new pages on Symthic site.

Edit: That said, Symthic is 90% about the community. If somebody provides solid numbers based on files or extensive testing, I could create "dumb" pages for it where to store the numbers and add a link on the front page of Symthic. That way people would find it easier than just forum post.
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

ViperFTW

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 4:49pm

Couldn't we also allow the use of methodologically tested (if not verified via the files) data? The "something is better than nothing" approach?

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Song currently stuck in my head is: Somewhere Beyond Seas by Varathron!

Miffyli

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 4:52pm

The "something is better than nothing" approach?

Weell we have allowed it in a way, but it needs to be solidish. Eg. Multiple times shot at same spot at same range or frame analysis. It's indeed better than nothing and often enough, but there could be hidden variables you can't "analyse" with this kind of manual method :)
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

ViperFTW

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 4:56pm

The "something is better than nothing" approach?

Weell we have allowed it in a way, but it needs to be solidish. Eg. Multiple times shot at same spot at same range or frame analysis. It's indeed better than nothing and often enough, but there could be hidden variables you can't "analyse" with this kind of manual method :)


What I meant when I said "Methodological" was basically this ;)

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Song currently stuck in my head is: Somewhere Beyond Seas by Varathron!

Miffyli

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 5:17pm

@ViperFTW
Oh wups, okey :D. Well we have that kind of stuff around the forums, and if it's good enough I could put up a separate page for it (with a note about manual testing instead of data mining).
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

yugas42

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 6:06pm

@ViperFTW

There still has to be some kind of demand for the stats in the first place. In doing manual testing we would also have to find people willing to sit around for hours and figure this stuff out, and that also means finding people who have specifically 'insert game X here'. If people do want this information to be out there it's not just as simple as me hopping on my xbox and booting up Halo 5, because a lot of us don't own consoles anymore. We're basically outsourcing our testing here, and that always results in questionable accuracy.

ViperFTW

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 6:46pm

@ViperFTW

There still has to be some kind of demand for the stats in the first place. In doing manual testing we would also have to find people willing to sit around for hours and figure this stuff out, and that also means finding people who have specifically 'insert game X here'. If people do want this information to be out there it's not just as simple as me hopping on my xbox and booting up Halo 5, because a lot of us don't own consoles anymore. We're basically outsourcing our testing here, and that always results in questionable accuracy.


Oh no, I wasn't denying that in the slightest. My question was purely: "Would this sort of results still be considered valid here?" and you've both answered that for me "Yes, but so long as it's tested properly. And even then, numbers are better", which is what I thought from the beginning :)

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Song currently stuck in my head is: Somewhere Beyond Seas by Varathron!

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Tuesday, July 5th 2016, 9:37pm

Halo 5 is one of my main games at the moment, and I'd love to help with this sort of testing, but that said, this guy has an amazing series of videos on the details of weapon stats and performance, he's very good. Any of us trying to put something together would really just be redundant, I think.
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