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91

Saturday, December 8th 2018, 2:29am

Well, light tanks need some counterpart anw, they don't take anymore the 75 damage per hit, but between 25 and 50 damage (kinda random, I havent figured why yet). They got such insane firing power, they melt infantry and on top of that, they got better mobility which negates the bad aspect of tank station (everytime I lose my instant repair, I go back to repair station, it costs few time) and they can escape combat quite easily. As long as you survive 5 seconds, it's enough to disengage and instantly getting back full hp with the repair tool.


Flanking is still needed vs heavier tanks or you need dynamite (which requires also strategy etc, especially vs S mine launcher), as you will deal between 15 and 30 damage to heavy tanks with panzerfaust.

I feel the biggest losers right now are medium tanks (Panzer IV, Valentine). They are average at everything, I can still do really good score with Panzer IV, but mostly because enemy team is bad. I feel a tank should be strong at one thing so you can focus on one specific game style. Aggressive and sneaky if you play light tanks or sniping if you play heavy tanks. (which kinda sucks with Tiger btw, his MG is so inacurate, it can't snipe people at long range)

Also British tanks are so strong, I feel its unbalanced for german side.

This post has been edited 3 times, last edit by "Jojo_Bizarre" (Dec 8th 2018, 2:36am)


Darktan13

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92

Saturday, December 8th 2018, 3:12am

Turret should not have the same armour as the rear.

Ruins the hull down concept.

BF3/4 had the correct armour configuration for gameplay. I have nothing against being able to incapacitate various key elements of the tank of course, but people should be rewarded properly for flanking / hiding and the like by landing more devastating hits.

BFV light tank armour scheme offers no additional reward for better flanks, since simply striking the turret is basically just as good as a full rear flank. Stupid.

and yes sometimes it's hard to get max damage, thats good, thats the whole point. Tanks should be killable in general, but much more vulnerable when outplayed positionally, current setup does not reward skillful play.

Quoted from "J0hn-Stuart-Mill"


NoctyrneSAGA

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93

Saturday, December 8th 2018, 3:36am

How are UK tanks better?

The German ones get the mine launchers which are extremely important to make up for the loss of snap aim turrets.
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94

Saturday, December 8th 2018, 6:12am

I feel like people are arguing as if the game now has zero angling or differing damage values for sides at all, which certainly isn't the case. Balance exists on a sliding scale; to go to one extreme, 100 damage to the rear and 0 damage to the front would certainly encourage more positioning-based gameplay... but that doesn't inherently mean it's actually better gameplay.

While personal playstyle is subjective, the argument that mine launchers are "necessary" definitely falls under this category; I don't have them on any tank and have rarely put myself in a position that they would have been of substantial help. And no, I definitely don't sit on the edge of every map sniping all the time. We console players have effectively had limited rotation all along, and tank gameplay has always been fun and engaging, but I'm sure it takes a bit more work to adapt to for PC players.


Tanks could certainly use a few adjustments, like the anti-armour shells being incredibly underwhelming, but as a whole they're in a pretty good place right now. Planes, on the other hand, have been screwed over pretty hard this patch, I'm not even sure how all these changes made it in. It feels like the devs made a brainstorming list of possible ways to nerf planes a bit, and then decided to just implement literally everything they came up with.
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NoctyrneSAGA

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95

Saturday, December 8th 2018, 6:31am

For the light tank, which we specifically are talking about, facing does in fact not matter and all 4 sides effectively have the same damage multipliers and scaling.

The rear is from 0.2x to 1.67x. The sides are from 0.2x to 1.67x with the exact same breakpoints. The front goes from 0.2x to 1.0x but that doesn't matter because the turret, which can be fired on from pretty much all sides is 1.67x no matter what angle you hit it at.

It doesn't take more work to adapt. Other games have featured it before BFV on PC. Dislike for a system isn't just because of a failure to adapt. People can be fine adapting and still hate a system or like what the alternative brought to the table.
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rainkloud

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Saturday, December 8th 2018, 8:26am

Tanks could certainly use a few adjustments, like the anti-armour shells being incredibly underwhelming, but as a whole they're in a pretty good place right now. Planes, on the other hand, have been screwed over pretty hard this patch, I'm not even sure how all these changes made it in. It feels like the devs made a brainstorming list of possible ways to nerf planes a bit, and then decided to just implement literally everything they came up with.


The anti armour shells are very potent if you're talking about HESH, APCR and the like. Where are you seeing the problem? The Mine clearing charge does suck immensely though. I'm mildly stunned it didn't get touched. That thing has low ammo, limited aiming and weak blast damage and radius. Maybe they could make it spot mines automatically has a passive ability to add utility to it.

The overreaction to the plane adjustments is one of the most sad and pathetic things I've witnessed in BF history. That's not to say that everything is perfect but for example the complaints about the bombers are absurd from what I have seen so far. The reload appears to be 30 seconds but what no one I see is talking about is that you don't have to fly around in circles during that whole time. Most of your targets are going to be significant distance away from the resupply point so in reality you just have to delay your approach by a few seconds. They make it sound like you're just site seeing for 30 seconds.

The Ammo thing for fighters is also absurd. Prepatch I never even had to consider a trip back to base to reload main cannon ammo. I had to go back enough anyways to repair deep damage so I was covered. It was like attrition didn't even apply to me. Post patch I am still able to operate fine for the most part. I would say now there are the occasional times where I do have to swing by for ammo alone although that is rare. There's also complaints about certain high caliber weapons being cutback too much ammo wise but what is not considered is that this is consistent with the concept of having a special supplementary shell with more limited ammo. Tanks get like 18 shells and then 6 special shells like APCR to use. Your special and high caliber weapons virtually always have less ammo than does your main.

But the Pilots slammed reddit hard with all these melodramatic posts and the community has largely bought it up because most of them are ignorant of game mechanics and they hear this massive pilot echo chamber and think it's 100% legitimate.

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97

Saturday, December 8th 2018, 11:36am

How are UK tanks better?

The German ones get the mine launchers which are extremely important to make up for the loss of snap aim turrets.
Staghound with better MG/cannon (more accurate, higher velocity), dumbfire rockets. AA tank with case round. Churchill with howitzer cannon. Maintenance drills (half repairing time, repairing value doesnt matter as its mostly to repair tracks/Engine)
I haven't play yet Gun carrier as I felt it was weak, but I might try it on Panzerstorm, the ones I faced were really tanky.

What german side got? Well, smoke launcher on most tanks and this S mine launcher, which isnt mandatory, how often infantry comes close to your tank? rarely.
You can't even take APCR on 38T with 20mm cannon, so it's pointless. PAK on Panzer IV is nice vs infantry because of splash damage but it's average vs others tanks. (not the same accuracy as a stationnary PAK)

What a lot of people forget is that you can move your turret really fast by moving BOTH your tank and the turret.

@Rainkloud well reddit BF5 is pure cancer, people don't understand most mechanics or they don't even play the class, they just jump on the bandwagon if one complain about something. I have no problem farming the map with my bomber. I still one shot most tanks without being accurate. I can bomb infantry on each pass (no reason to use all bombs at the same time) without any delay. (50 70 kills on average on Fjell). AA are stronger, that's right but well, it's really easy kills if you are sneaky, you just can't facetank them anymore. It's just sad that people can take so many AA tanks at once and won't move from red zone.

My friend has no problem with fighter either.

And for AT shells, APCR is weak, it's a waste of time switching to it except for its accuracy depending of your loadout (Panzer IV for instance). HESH/HEAT are really strong however.

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "Jojo_Bizarre" (Dec 8th 2018, 11:47am)


NoctyrneSAGA

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98

Saturday, December 8th 2018, 12:04pm

As much as I love the Tulips, the Staghound has wheels, not tracks. The velocity isn't that big of a deal since they're all faster compared to alpha/beta and in an actually usable state.

German tanks can also use the case round, maybe not on the Flakpanzer but the AA Valentine does not hold a monopoly.

Smoke Launcher is a callback to older CMs and pretty much mandatory to break LoS.

It's actually fairly easy for infantry to close in unless you're sitting really far out. I've had to deploy the S-Mines enough times for it to be worth picking.

Tanks shouldn't bother fighting other tanks. It's a boring slug-fest unless you picked up the specialty shells. Just farm infantry unless you have a clear shot on the rear/sides.

What a lot of people forget is that you can move your turret really fast by moving BOTH your tank and the turret.


Pretty sure any tank driver worth their salt already does this.

But it doesn't work on the Staghound and having good traverse speed doesn't help if your depression doesn't go low enough to engage infantry next to your tank. In fact, the Staghound is the vehicle I want S-Mines on the most because its gun sits so high.

Throw in a lost track/tire/engine and you are basically left with no good way to get rid of infantry near your tank.

Could you argue that a tank shouldn't be so close to infantry in the first place? Sure and you'd probably be right.

Does this stop sneaky infantry from pulling off a flank? No. And when that happens I'd love to have an instant kill panic button that can save my rep monkeys and myself. I'm not going to pretend that it's completely impossible for someone to get close to me.



To be fair, when the tank gun velocities were so bad you had to be on top of infantry anyways, the Mine Launchers were mandatory.

WIth the buffed velocity, you can range down infantry again. But if DICE ever decides to go back to Alpha/Beta velocities, I won't have much to worry about.
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99

Saturday, December 8th 2018, 12:45pm

You can't deny that Tiger MG is bad right? There is a huge difference between Staghound MG and Tiger MG for instance. Why don't you like wheels? Sometimes I get stuck with my Staghound, but with the cannon recoil, I can manage to unstuck me. It doesn't change anything in combat anw. It has better mobility than 38T on german side.

Yes smoke launcher is the reason I enjoy german tanks, it is so great, especially in tank vs tank fight as it gives you vision in 3rd person view. Not because of S mine launcher. I find it funnier doing kills with it than being efficient, but maybe that's because I play with a gunner.

Did you play AA valentine? This tank is totally overpowered. Panzer IV got case round, but long switching time (it's fast on AA Valentine), low fire rate (high rof on AA Valentine) and only 8 shells (40 on Valentine). https://youtu.be/q3itzE41I9I just as an example, and now I'm able to aim correctly in 3rd person view so I'm fine moving and killing targets.

Hau_ruck

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Saturday, December 8th 2018, 3:52pm

I feel like people are arguing as if the game now has zero angling or differing damage values for sides at all, which certainly isn't the case. Balance exists on a sliding scale; to go to one extreme, 100 damage to the rear and 0 damage to the front would certainly encourage more positioning-based gameplay... but that doesn't inherently mean it's actually better gameplay.

While personal playstyle is subjective, the argument that mine launchers are "necessary" definitely falls under this category; I don't have them on any tank and have rarely put myself in a position that they would have been of substantial help. And no, I definitely don't sit on the edge of every map sniping all the time. We console players have effectively had limited rotation all along, and tank gameplay has always been fun and engaging, but I'm sure it takes a bit more work to adapt to for PC players.


Tanks could certainly use a few adjustments, like the anti-armour shells being incredibly underwhelming, but as a whole they're in a pretty good place right now. Planes, on the other hand, have been screwed over pretty hard this patch, I'm not even sure how all these changes made it in. It feels like the devs made a brainstorming list of possible ways to nerf planes a bit, and then decided to just implement literally everything they came up with.


I had been thinking that it must be weird for PC players to finally face the more realistic turret speeds that console have always had. PC turret speed always looked so weird to me. I'm glad BFV has turret speed as an extra metric to use when balancing armour. It really gives light tanks a much needed advantage.