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  • "Sapphidia" started this thread

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1

Monday, October 27th 2014, 4:03pm

Suppressed Bullet Hit Registration

Warning - "feels" post rather than concrete data.

I hop back and forth often between "use a suppressor on just about everything" and "suppressors suck" pretty much daily. Whilst my close range sneaky playstyle tends to favor suppressors... I find myself losing engagements with suppressed weapons which my mind tells me I would have won with a standard barrel or muzzle brake or something.

I appreciate slower bullet travel time and slightly more bullet drop will make hitting -moving- targets a lot harder, but I find with suppressed weapons that it often feels like a lot of my mid-range bullets miss almost stationary targets. And trying to hit things with a suppressed DMR even at fairly close ranges just feels like a crapshoot. I'm not the best aim in the world but I feel a hundred times more confidant with a standard unsuppressed weapon at all but super close ranges.

Do other people experience this? It just feels like some of my suppressed bullets simply disappear when I swear they should hit even with the slower rate. I never get this feeling at all with unsuppressed weapons. Am I overlooking some mechanic here - is the bullet velocity that vital even at close to mid range?

Pastafarianism

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2

Monday, October 27th 2014, 4:12pm

Suppressors can really shit on MV, which is (for me) even a problem in close-medium range. I use suppressors when I feel like flanking like a mofo, and though my accuracy doesn't decrease (that I can tell), my shots usually end up being leg shots.
Other than that, the files say nothing about suppressors affecting accuracy, that I know of, minus a small hipfire penalty.

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3

Monday, October 27th 2014, 4:41pm

Suppressors absolutely destroy a weapon's muzzle velocity, and they pretty much require the user to lead their targets even at mid range. ~300 m/s is brutal to manage which is why you'll want to aim center mass and always lead a moving target even if they are just walking. It is that bad.

I would almost recommend using a Magnifier, 3.4x, or even 4x optics to visually see how severe the reduction in muzzle velocity actually is. Extra magnification will definitely help to locate where the bullets are in accordance to the target.

And like Pasta said, the only GunSway modifier is a 0.2 degree penalty to hipfire stances:

Spoiler Spoiler

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StandNoZoomModifier::GunSwayStanceZoomModifierData
        DispersionMod::GunSwayDispersionModData
            MinAngleModifier 1.2
            MaxAngleModifier 1.0
            IncreasePerShotModifier 1.0
            DecreasePerSecondModifier 1.0


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CrouchNoZoomModifier::GunSwayStanceZoomModifierData
        DispersionMod::GunSwayDispersionModData
            MinAngleModifier 1.2
            MaxAngleModifier 1.0
            IncreasePerShotModifier 1.0
            DecreasePerSecondModifier 1.0


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ProneNoZoomModifier::GunSwayStanceZoomModifierData
        DispersionMod::GunSwayDispersionModData
            MinAngleModifier 1.2
            MaxAngleModifier 1.0
            IncreasePerShotModifier 1.0
            DecreasePerSecondModifier 1.0
To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question.

Nope. Aim Assist or bust; here's why:

Default Aim Assist Data

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.75
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 1.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.34
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.2
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 1.2
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0

No Slowdown Data

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.0
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 1.0
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom -1.0
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.0
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 0.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.0
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.0
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
    DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0


No Auto Rotation Data

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 AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.75
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 1.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.34
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.0
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
    DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0

Prepare your laughbox

the Sebstalder is quiet good since it can 3hit kill at any distanc ,but In my opinion i actually thikn the sweeper is better, its got a really really fast firerate that can beat alll those Noobmaticos, Helregall adn shitguns in close quarters , and its also really accurate out to like l;ong range,. overall great allround gun, jsut my 2$ tho

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "JSLICE20" (Oct 27th 2014, 5:11pm)


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4

Monday, October 27th 2014, 4:51pm

I tend to put suppressors on higher rpm weapons like the ACW and F2k, which seem to struggle longer range anyway. For that reason i tend to tap fire them as much as possible outside 25-30m. I think my reasoning is because they're closer range weapons anyway, long range accuracy isn't what i'm looking for. So the flanking and ability to quickly take down 1-2 baddies without others noticing is more helpful. The last thing i want when coming up behind 2 noobs is the 2nd to turn around and kill me as i'm killing his buddy.

Lower rpm weapons like the pkp i'll run unsuppressed because i don't flank with it or push points quite as aggressively.

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5

Monday, October 27th 2014, 7:06pm

And like Pasta said, the only GunSway modifier is a 0.2 degree 20 % penalty to hipfire stances
FTFY. Those modifiers are multiplicative and doesn't give spread in actual degrees.

Things people said

And reading Youtube comments still gives me Turbo Cancer.

It really is quite frustrating when Helen Keller sets up her LMG in the only doorway in/out of an area.

What kind of question is that? Since when is cheese ever a bad idea?

Hardline is a fun and sometimes silly Cops and Robbers sorta thing and I think that's great. Or it would be if it didn't suck.

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6

Monday, October 27th 2014, 7:48pm

3k+ kills here with a weapon that fired at 290m/s at 260rpm. It definitely feels like the game does take bullet travel time into account. So, if both me and my opponent fire the killing shot to each other simultaneously, the game awards the kill to the guy with the higher velocity (which, in my case, is pretty much always never me :( )

And then, if I happen to try and fire just as his killing round is in the air, then my firing command is ignored. I can see how this can be perceived as "hitreg issue," because I would feel like I was on target and clicked but nothing happened to the target and I died.

I accept it as the price of staying off the minimap, though. When you start shooting at people's backsides then it doesn't happen :P

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Veritable" (Oct 27th 2014, 8:15pm)


NoctyrneSAGA

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7

Monday, October 27th 2014, 7:58pm

@Veritable

Vanishing bullets should only happen if the server identifies you were dead before it was fired.

If the bullet is already on its way from the server's perspective, it shouldn't be despawned until it hits something or its TTL has expired.
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8

Monday, October 27th 2014, 8:04pm

And like Pasta said, the only GunSway modifier is a 0.2 degree 20 % penalty to (stationary) hipfire stances
FTFY. Those modifiers are multiplicative and doesn't give spread in actual degrees.
FTFY as well.
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9

Monday, October 27th 2014, 8:15pm


Vanishing bullets should only happen if the server identifies you were dead before it was fired.

If the bullet is already on its way from the server's perspective, it shouldn't be despawned until it hits something or its TTL has expired.

Yep. Actually I wouldn't call it "vanishing" because when the situation as I described happened, my gun didn't shoot despite my click.

I'm not griping, though, as I almost always Q-spot him before firing, so I almost always end up with an Assist Counts as Kill so it's indirectly a "trade" (2 hits with a DMR at close-medium range in Core is always over 80 damage), not to mention the added Suppression Assist points.

Like I said, nobody is forcing me to use a Suppressor.... ;)

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10

Monday, October 27th 2014, 8:18pm

And like Pasta said, the only GunSway modifier is a 0.2 degree 20 % penalty to hipfire stances
FTFY. Those modifiers are multiplicative and doesn't give spread in actual degrees.

Yes, I had forgotten the values represent a multiplier. However, I'm not so sure about the degrees claim. Miffyli confirmed through undeadpixels that all things spread is measured in degrees, which would include hipfire.
To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question.

Nope. Aim Assist or bust; here's why:

Default Aim Assist Data

Source code

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.75
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 1.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.34
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.2
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 1.2
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0

No Slowdown Data

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.0
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 1.0
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom -1.0
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.0
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 0.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.0
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.0
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
    DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0


No Auto Rotation Data

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 AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.75
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 1.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.34
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.0
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
    DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0

Prepare your laughbox

the Sebstalder is quiet good since it can 3hit kill at any distanc ,but In my opinion i actually thikn the sweeper is better, its got a really really fast firerate that can beat alll those Noobmaticos, Helregall adn shitguns in close quarters , and its also really accurate out to like l;ong range,. overall great allround gun, jsut my 2$ tho