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  • "inxence" started this thread

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Thursday, December 11th 2014, 3:00pm

SCAR-H vs Bulldog ?

SCAR-H vs Bulldog what the best 7.62 AR for u ?

Pastafarianism

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Thursday, December 11th 2014, 4:08pm

Depends on the map bro. Longer range, SCAR all the way. Shorter range, Bulldoge

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Thursday, December 11th 2014, 4:56pm

Overall I'd SCAR H, the Bulldog may absolutely shred people up-close but it struggles at range. The long reload with that short clip-size is also a big drawback compared to the SCAR.

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Thursday, December 11th 2014, 5:42pm

These rifles are good if you consistently land head shots or never miss. I would use the SCAR if you are trying to do either of those things.

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Thursday, December 11th 2014, 9:57pm

Used to be more of a toss-up when the Bulldog didn't have 0.4 hRecoil both directions, but I have to agree with Pastafarianism and Airhornet. The bullpup/higher RoF makes the Bulldog more competitive in CQB, but with the hRecoil nearly the same as the LMGs, asking the Bulldog for much accuracy beyond CQB requires tap-firing, which largely neuters its RoF advantage.

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Thursday, December 11th 2014, 10:36pm

Scar-H if you want to tap fire.

Bulldog when M14.

any other answer or opinion is wrong.
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Friday, December 12th 2014, 2:37am

Scar-H if you want to tap fire.

Bulldog when M14.

any other answer or opinion is wrong.
But, but, but... Ok. Anyways, in my opinion (which is now invalid) the bulldog is only good if you have a good support player nearby to give ammo because maybe this is just me but whenever I use the bulldog I empty the whole mag in one burst unless I'm REALLY careful, and that doesn't help with the reload speed. So Scar-H is better in my opinion.
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Zer0Cod3x

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Friday, December 12th 2014, 7:36am

SCAR-H 4 lyfe. Bulldog's like the FAMAS but worse.
something something Model 8 bestgun


How to ice an A-91

Next, wanna try adding a guy that you KNOW is bad, and just testing to see that? Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

PP-2000 added. Y'know, it's not that bad....

Yes, it comes in last so far, but that is mostly because I'm making it shoot at 100m ADS - Not Moving as one of the criteria. Even then, between 50-100m Not Moving, when you include Useability, it is only 1.37% worse than the MTAR-21. Within 50m then it even beats the A-91.

Have a look, vs. the A-91 Carbine:




Using it with Muzzle Brake and Compensator is a wash in terms of overall performance. Comp is SLIGHTLY more accurate, while MB is SLIGHTLY more easy to use. Their overall scores are basically tied, with MB just ahead. I guess either can be recommended.

But... You can't be counting for the fact that it takes 9 bullets to kill at "long" range... Don't you dare tell me my A-91 is worse than a 9 BTK 650 RPM mediocre PDW.

Also. Just go heavy barrel. The recoil is low enough.

Well, technically...

Comparing a PP2K with HB and an A-91 with comp and stubby (as you suggested in an earlier post), at 50m not moving, the A-91 is only better by 4 damage per hitrate. While at 75m and 100m, surprisingly the PP2K does better than the A-91 (I'm pretty damn surprised as well).

And 10m and 50m moving the PP2K also does more damage per hitrate than the A-91. At 25m the A-91 is only better by about half a bullet's damage as well.

In addition, the PP2K has a much larger mag size and substantially less recoil. And it looks hella awesome. So comparing the A-91 to a PDW is of some worth after all, as the PP2K is better (technically, not practically) than the A-91.

Mind blown.

I... I...

*cries in a corner*

Zer0Cod3x explained it very well. If you look at the raw numbers right here on Symthic Comparison, you can see how that happened:

A-91 vs PP-2000 | BF4 Weapon Comparison | Symthic

A-91's "23%" RPM advantage only afforded it 1 extra round.

Reload times are wash.

Velocities are wash.

V-Recoil are wash (and this is HBar on PP2k vs. A-91 without).

Hipfire and ADS - Moving are better on the PP2k, but it's a PDW and not the surprising part.

The surprising part is that, as equipped (and we see above that PP2k HBar has almost same V-Recoil as A-91 without HBar so why not?), the PDW performs better at 50 - 100m than a bloody Carbine. Why?

H-Recoil Spread, 0.525 vs. 0.45, advantage PP2k.

SIPS, 42% better on the PP2k.

And here is the most important part. ADS - Not Moving Spread, 0.35 vs. 0.2, 43% improvement.

Without HBar then of course the PP2k loses, which is why when I add all the attachments together for an Overall Ranking, it would slot below the A-91. Run HBar on it, though, then... I'm sorry

@Veritable
@Zer0Cod3x
I... I...
But...
Wha...
I AM HAVING AN EXISTENTIAL CRISIS IN SCHOOL BECAUSE OF YOU TWO.

FUCK YOU NERDS AND YOUR FANCY NUMBERS

SEXY RUSSIAN BULLPUPS FTW.

In all seriousness, thank you both so much for giving me the numbers. I still don't want to accept them. You have led the horse to water. I still need to drink.


marbleduck

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9

Friday, December 12th 2014, 7:52am

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I would have said "bulldog", without hesitation, prior to the recent update to it, it's more of a toss-up, now. Bulldog gets a nicer velocity (yes, the difference really is quite noticeable), and a much nicer hipfire. The RoF is cool too, as you can tap it faster at range, but as you need the compensator to be even a little bit accurate at midrange, it's got significantly more h-recoil than the SCAR, which goes with the Muzzle Brake nicely.

Honestly, I've been sticking to the SCAR over the 'dog in most every situation these days. The SCAR's reload+controllability just makes it that much better at more things. Bulldog does outdamage the AEK up close (plus it's bullpup, so it gets good hip spread), so if you want a weapon that does that, use it over the SCAR.

Post patch, stubby+brake+laser+coyote is the way to go with the SCAR (with lower 7.62 dmg you actually need the stubby because you need to put longer bursts down)

Comp+ergo+laser+coyote is the 'dog loadout of choice. CQB is where it's good, might as well make it good at that. Comp for added functionality at midrange.

If any of you suggest HB+ergo on either of these, I'll...

SCAR-H 4 lyfe. Bulldog's like the FAMAS but worse.


Bulldog is significantly more versatile than the FAMAS. it gets comparable DPS, and thanks to 7.62 damage model+lowish RoF, it's actually moderately capable at range. Can't do range with the FAMAS, not even a little bit.

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This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "marbleduck" (Dec 12th 2014, 7:57am)


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Friday, December 12th 2014, 9:05am

Well, not hb+ergo maybe, but I don't see the brake as a legitimate idea either since it got nerfed to oblivion. It's like 10% less vertical recoil now right?

I'd go with the SCAR. Bulldog was nice before the patch but now I don't really see a reason to use it.