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## BF4 shooting mechanics

Hey! If this is your first visit on symthic.com, also check out our weapon damage charts.
Currently we have charts for Battlefield 3, Call of Duty: Black Ops 2, Medal of Honor: Warfighter and Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3

Be Creative.

Posts: 7,811

Date of registration
: Mar 9th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Portugal

Reputation modifier: 19

Monday, October 20th 2014, 9:47am

### Quoted from "JSLICE20"

That they'll recruit hackers, computer gurus, or even some from our staff

Don't forget the FBI and the NSA.

Skynet T100

Posts: 1,614

Date of registration
: Apr 12th 2013

Platform: PC

Location: Guilin Peaks, Finland

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 14

Monday, October 20th 2014, 11:25am

### Quoted from "JSLICE20"

I knew rate of fire wasn't as important as others made it out to be! This is pure gold! Does this mean low rate of fire weapons have a sizable chance against high rate of fire weapons if the user is super accurate?

Exactly. Low rpm weapons have an initial advantage by having the same de facto rpm but less recoil and spread decrease. But if these bullets don't give the kill, the low rpm player still has to suffer either the subsequently lower rpm in sustained shooting or the longer time-between-bursts.

Instead of looking into awkward frame rates (non-multiples of 30 Hz), I think the next step should be finding out the termination conditions for a burst and the timing for when the gun can fire again. These info can then be used to identify the optimal burst sizes etc. (and no, I did not say 'exploits' or 'mechanic-abuse-possibilities' coz I'm sure there are none ).

### Quoted

Haha, an analysis of this magnitude leads me to believe a DICE employee will see what you (and all those involved) have discovered and make it their mission that this information does not leak to the public. That they'll recruit hackers, computer gurus, or even some from our staff to suppress or even eliminate this thread and all its contents.

I'm sure Miffyli has made Symthic nuke-proof.
"Less is more? How can that be? How could less be more, that's impossible. More is more." Yngwie Malmsten
"Many bullets help." WoopsyYaya
"most rhetorically legitimate ad hominem 2015" ToTheSun!

The only man who ever reported his own post!

Posts: 2,980

Date of registration
: Jul 19th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Grenoble, France

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 14

Monday, October 20th 2014, 12:25pm

We get back on the old adage : microbusrting is your friend.

Sent from phone.
Stats thingy

### Quoted from "Cheapnub"

I'm a battlefield player, good sir. I don't play metro.

### Quoted from "Suiizide"

PC is no longer PC master race. It's PC mustard race, because consoles need to ketchup :'D

### Quoted from "Riesig"

DICE gave so much into making commander better, but lemmings be lemmings I guess.

### Quoted from "MrT3a"

As a good guy that don't want to use overly glitched weapons, I'll quit using the MTAR and switch to the ACWR until it's fixed

The world needs more people like you

+1, I think we're all in agreement that more MrT3as would be an awesome thing
Although if that was the case they'd use up so much of the world's awesome that there'd be none left for the rest of us!

### Quoted from "CobaltRose"

yes, I know, I'm a big-ass hypocrite

Respected

Posts: 1,487

Date of registration
: Jul 20th 2012

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 15

Monday, October 20th 2014, 4:07pm

one thing of note:

what the game is showing us, isn't necessarily what the game is doing. much of this thread consists of looking at recorded footage and spotting the muzzle flash, but that doesn't necessarily indicate when the actual bullet is fired.

on the other hand, this info (thanks 3VN and Miffyli!) does conform with what we already know about 900+ RPM weapons, being that they fire their first two shots with no recoil.

so for now: fire everything in 2 round bursts!

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "tehmoriz" (Oct 20th 2014, 4:22pm)

Symthic Developer

Posts: 3,725

Date of registration
: Mar 21st 2013

Platform: PC

Location: __main__, Finland

Reputation modifier: 17

Monday, October 20th 2014, 4:14pm

### Quoted from "tehmoriz"

what the game is showing us, isn't necessarily what the game is doing. much of this thread consists of looking at recorded footage and spotting the muzzle flash, but that doesn't necessarily indicate when the actual bullet is fired.

Ummm... No video recording was used here, only values from the memory along with a timestamp. While it is possible those values are off (ie. spesifically the one we're looking for is somewhere else) I really doubt it and they seem spot-on.
• 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
• leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
• Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
• Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

Skynet T100

Posts: 1,614

Date of registration
: Apr 12th 2013

Platform: PC

Location: Guilin Peaks, Finland

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 14

Monday, October 20th 2014, 4:23pm

### Quoted from "tehmoriz"

what the game is showing us, isn't necessarily what the game is doing. much of this thread consists of looking at recorded footage and spotting the muzzle flash, but that doesn't necessarily indicate when the actual bullet is fired.

This is a valid concern. The line of evidence so far is:

1) frame-by-frame analysis of video captures show a bullet tracer in the same frame as the muzzle flash
2) still in the video, in the frame following muzzle flash, all V recoil is applied (aimpoint is moved so if bullet is out, it has to be shot before v recoil is applied)
3) concurrent video and memory recordings show that memory recoil values are always synchronized with the video recoil, hence the rest of the memory-probe data (i.e. all data studied in this thread) are likely to match video data
4) hence the most likely 'bullet-out' frame is the one before the 'V-recoil frame'.

To get conclusive in-game evidence for the bullet being generated in this frame, we are going to need teh haxors. And then, can the bullet hit already in this frame or is hit-reg handled in the following one?
"Less is more? How can that be? How could less be more, that's impossible. More is more." Yngwie Malmsten
"Many bullets help." WoopsyYaya
"most rhetorically legitimate ad hominem 2015" ToTheSun!

Respected

Posts: 1,487

Date of registration
: Jul 20th 2012

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 15

Monday, October 20th 2014, 4:23pm

### Quoted from "Miffyli"

Ummm... No video recording was used here, only values from the memory along with a timestamp. While it is possible those values are off (ie. spesifically the one we're looking for is somewhere else) I really doubt it and they seem spot-on.

this is what i get for not unhiding the spoiler tag. thanks for the correction.

Posts: 582

Date of registration
: Sep 3rd 2013

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 9

Monday, October 20th 2014, 4:34pm

### Quoted from "tehmoriz"

on the other hand, this info (thanks 3VN and Miffyli!) does conform with what we already know about 900+ RPM weapons, being that they fire their first two shots with no recoil. i can't read!
So, I'm pretty dumb with regards with to this, but is this accurately understood:

- Weapons at 900+ RPM get a bonus in that they fire the first two shots with no recoil (or only one count of recoil)

- Weapons at slower RPM (say, <700 RPM) get a bonus in that they actually fire the first few rounds at around 900 RPM

So assuming this is correct, where is the breaking point? At what RPM does it sync up perfectly with the update rate?

Respected

Posts: 1,487

Date of registration
: Jul 20th 2012

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 15

Monday, October 20th 2014, 4:45pm

### Quoted from "Jais"

So, I'm pretty dumb with regards with to this, but is this accurately understood:

- Weapons at 900+ RPM get a bonus in that they fire the first two shots with no recoil (or only one count of recoil)

- Weapons at slower RPM (say, <700 RPM) get a bonus in that they actually fire the first few rounds at around 900 RPM

So assuming this is correct, where is the breaking point? At what RPM does it sync up perfectly with the update rate?

well, judging from 3VN's graphs, the breaking points are: 590 RPM, and 900 RPM. possibly related to the 59.95/2 hz refresh rates, which suggests that the optimal RPMs are actually 599.5 and 899.95, if i'm understanding it correctly.

Posts: 3,292

Date of registration
: Apr 26th 2013

Platform: PS4

Location: Arizona, USA

Reputation modifier: 15

Monday, October 20th 2014, 5:29pm

Woah, so this would mean that a SAR-21 2-round micro-burst is the prime candidate here. Ho-ho-ho, look out high fire-rate sluts, there's a new sheriff in town, even though he's been here this whole time! Remarkable.
To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question.

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