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  • "Veritable" started this thread

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Monday, May 16th 2016, 11:22pm

Shoot-and-Recover Time Calculator

Here is a Google Sheets spreadsheet I just made that will calculate for you the time it takes for a BF4 gun to shoot a certain burst length and then recover back to starting spread.

Click here for the Google Sheets spreadsheet

Due to the way BF4 Shooting Mechanics function, it is possible for the same gun with different attachment combinations (and thus different SIPS and SDec values) to have the SAME "optimal click rate" (ie shoot-recover-shoot). Or, in more extreme cases, different guns with different RoF to shoot the "same" by playing around with barrels / grip / server environment / burst length.

It is set up so you can EDIT Cells A2 to F21. Here are the descriptions for what you should be entering into them and how they affect things.

Column A (Name): Just the name for the weapon + attachment combo you want to look at. Enter anything here; it doesn't affect the calculation.

Column B (RoF): Rate of Fire for the weapon. Enter a value between 1 and 2000. The value is set for a gun in BF4, and does not change regardless of attachments. Exceptions are AK-12 / AKU-12 / AN-94 which do change if you use Burst Fire. This stats is available from either Battlelog or BF4 Weapon Info. Guns with higher RoF shoots more bullets in the same time, or shoots the same number of bullets in a shorter time.

Column C (Fired): How many bullets you want the gun to fire. Enter a value between 1 and 200. You decide this value, and most likely will be from your own BF4 experience. My suggestion is to use average Bullets to Kill for the weapon, which makes sense as you tend to stop shooting once the target is supposed to be dead. eg 3 for DMRs, 4-5 for 7.62mm ARs / Carbines / GPMGs, 5-7 for 5.56mm ARs / Carbines / LMGs, 6-7 for PDWs, and so on. Shoot more bullets take longer time, and then have more SIPS to recover from, and thus wait longer to recover. Higher RoF guns shoot more bullets in less time, allowing you to start recovery earlier. So on and so forth.

Column D (Tickrate): The Server Tickrate of the server you play on, in Hz. Enter a value between 30 to 240. You can find this information on Battlelog, as each server detail information will say what Tickrate it is running on. When BF4 first started everyone was 30Hz. After DICE LA did their magic we now have more choices, depending on server hardware. 40Hz is common on PCs, 30Hz is still around, 45Hz is now the norm for PS4 / XB1, rare PC TDM servers run 60Hz and I've even seen a 120Hz server. More "ticks" mean more chance for the server to differentiate minute differences between guns' RoF, SIPS and SDec. Thus, setups that seem to perform the "same" in 30Hz no longer is the case in 40Hz, so you can run Ergo in 40Hz but then have to take it off in 30Hz (see M39 EMR 1RB).

Column E (SIPS): The Spread Increase Per Shot in Degrees. Enter a value between 0.01 and 1. I recommend using BF4 Multi-Comparison for this, so you can apply barrel + grip as both may affect it. Higher the value, the longer you need to wait even if you shoot short bursts. Shoot long bursts, accumulate more SIPS even if the value is low, and again have to wait for longer.

Column F (Spread Dec): The rate of Spread Decrease, in Degrees per Second. Enter a value between 1 and 20. Again, I recommend using BF4 Multi-Comparison for this, though it is slightly simpler as there are usually just 2 values per gun: any grip, or NoGrip. Flash Hider Barrel also affects it, but good thing nobody uses it.... :-P

Plug in all the values, and Column H (protected! as it contains the formula) will give you the Time (in Seconds, but usually in decimals unless your Burst Length is super long) that it takes for this weapon + attachments to fire your Burst Length and then finish all Spread Decrease, ready for you to shoot again. This Column is set for Conditional Formatting, and will highlight the lowest (and thus "best") value in Green, highest ("worst") in Red, median with no shading. Best and Worst usually have strong correlation to DPS performance, and is important. More interesting though will be the TIES. Attachment combos (and in rare cases completely different guns) with TIES will shoot very similarly, and if one have better ease-of-use or accuracy stats, then that is a no-brainer.

Currently I have the Ak5C Carbine, all possible attachment combinations, each shooting 5RB in a 45Hz server, displayed. Feel free to change things if you need some answers, but please make sure you enter proper BF4 Symthic Stats values... because as you heard, in Computer Science it's always Garbage In, Garbage Out.

Hopefully you will find this useful.

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Monday, May 16th 2016, 11:48pm

40hz common on pc? where do you live? i played only once in monnths on a server that didn't run either 30 or 60 hz.
"I'm just a loot whore."

stuff mostly unrelated to BF4 that interests nobody

on 13/05/2016
23rd M320FB user on pc(13/05/16)
rush mode score RANK:2794 TOP:2% OUT OF:215398
obliteration mode scoreRANK:994 TOP:1% OUT OF:159466
handgun medals RANK:2236 TOP:2% OUT OF:143874
longest headshot RANK:9512 TOP:4% OUT OF:257589
recon score RANK:10871 TOP:4% OUT OF:274899
general score per minute RANK:10016 TOP:4% OUT OF:294774

31/3/2012 4:58:

Headshot distance RANK:493* TOP:0%
Revives per assault minute RANK: 6019 TOP: 3%
Headshots / kill percentage RANK:25947 TOP:13%
MVP ribbons RANK:18824 TOP:11%

*= 6 if we not count the EOD BOT headshots





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Tuesday, May 17th 2016, 2:19pm

Been calculating this manualy for a while now, but it is always nice to have some easy to use tool!


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Tuesday, May 17th 2016, 2:34pm

Nice work! Juuust one question tho from functional side of things: If somebody changes those values to run test on weapon they want to check, doesn't it change the spreadsheet for everybody, being shared and all? Or can one set it so that others' changes do not show up?
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • InterimAegis - Weapon comparisons/scoring.
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • pmax - Statistical analysis of BF4 players/games.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

  • "Veritable" started this thread

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Tuesday, May 17th 2016, 10:35pm

If somebody changes those values to run test on weapon they want to check, doesn't it change the spreadsheet for everybody, being shared and all?

Yes! So just one person can use it at any one time I guess :P

To make things simpler I removed all the rows except for 2, so you can just directly compare 2 setups against each other. Currently I am displaying AEK-971 Comp + AFG set to 3RB mode vs. QBZ-95-1 HBar + Stubby also set to 3RB mode.

AEK-971 vs QBZ-95-1 | BF4 Weapon Comparison | Symthic

It shows that in 45Hz environment, despite the "38%" RoF differences, both guns shoot and recover within the same time. It is also true in 50Hz servers.

Granted the AEK is faster in 30Hz, 40Hz and 60Hz servers, but even just a cursory test with Hitrater will show that the QBZ has MUCH higher in-burst hit rates... and thus likely higher DPS despite being slower. In 45Hz / 50Hz environments, then GUARANTEED higher DPS.