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C0llis

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121

Monday, February 2nd 2015, 11:22am

Kill trading is also a result of time being discretizised in the game.

Ping also comes into play. During kill trading both players killed the other on their respective end, and I infinitely prefer kill trading over the server rolling back damage when the difference in "time" is so small that it usually is during kill trading. Shooting a guy up, seeing him loose health only to see that he is at full health in the killcam later is more frustrating IMO than killtrades.

I reckon kill trading can be likened to/explained as the other player pulling the trigger as he's dying.

Things people said

And reading Youtube comments still gives me Turbo Cancer.

It really is quite frustrating when Helen Keller sets up her LMG in the only doorway in/out of an area.

What kind of question is that? Since when is cheese ever a bad idea?

Hardline is a fun and sometimes silly Cops and Robbers sorta thing and I think that's great. Or it would be if it didn't suck.

NoctyrneSAGA

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122

Monday, February 2nd 2015, 11:39am

I reckon kill trading can be likened to/explained as the other player pulling the trigger as he's dying.


This is exactly what it is and why I love it. It's a two way street and I'd much rather have the ability to use it than not.
Data Browser

Passive Spotting is the future!

With this, I'll rid MGO3 of infestation. Sans bad gameplay MGO3 will be torn asunder. And then it shall be free. People will suffer, of course - a phantom pain.

Reddit and Konami will rewrite the records... And I will be demonized in human memory. But... The thirst for good gameplay that I have planted will infest MGO3. No one can stop it now. The Rebalance Mod will unleash that thirst unto the future.


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VincentNZ

Holy War? No Thanks.

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123

Monday, February 2nd 2015, 12:20pm

Agreed. Kill-trading is not unrealistic, and when thinking about ping, connectivity issues, hard to eliminate. After all BF goes the hard way and simulates real bullet physics instead of point-click-hit of many other FPS.

Pastafarianism

Mom's Spaghetti

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124

Monday, February 2nd 2015, 12:56pm

And about "the large majority of the community would agree with me" bullshit:

The large majority of the community is busy bitching about other things, and as they should be. Kill-trades are a core part of Battlefield, as having actual projectiles for bullet is core to the BF games.

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ToTheSun!

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125

Monday, February 2nd 2015, 1:06pm

Kill trading is also a result of time being discretizised in the game.

Ping also comes into play. During kill trading both players killed the other on their respective end, and I infinitely prefer kill trading over the server rolling back damage when the difference in "time" is so small that it usually is during kill trading. Shooting a guy up, seeing him loose health only to see that he is at full health in the killcam later is more frustrating IMO than killtrades.

I reckon kill trading can be likened to/explained as the other player pulling the trigger as he's dying.

Thank you. I was going to write that.

In fact, it's the only way whereby kill trading can be achieved, as the amount of times wherein kill trading occurs because of bullet physics is much lower, statistically speaking.

Also, the argument "if i wanted realism, i'd play ARMA" is dangerous because BF4 doesn't have to be a completely different game in every way just because it has a different title. Why can't it have some somewhat realistic aspects?
Instead, what you should be saying is "if i want a different game, i'll play a different game". It's impossible to appease everyone, and most people think that's what CTE is for. I don't understand why this happens. It's a weird phenomenon.
Kill trading is essential for a game that is played ONLINE with connections ranging from 50 to 200 ms ping, except for that one tournament that happens very infrequently wherein players pretend the game is made for 5v5. I'm not taking merit from where it's due, but BF4 was not optimized for LAN, nor can it be coded to reject hits after the deed has been done on your opponent's side because that would make a lot of people angry.

IMO, anyway.

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126

Monday, February 2nd 2015, 4:13pm

The lack of kill trading is half of why CoD games have become so frustrating the past few versions, I put six shots into a guy but because his connection is 10ms better than mine he gets a kill and two of my shots are erased from existence. It makes no sense and happened all the damn time in Blops 2.

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127

Tuesday, February 3rd 2015, 1:35am

Kill-trades are a core part of Battlefield
Really? That's a pretty bold claim right there.

having actual projectiles for bullet is core to the BF games.
Yeah, core since what? BF3?

Quoted

I'm going to go ahead and make an assumption on why you might be okay with RPG kill trading.
I think it's because players can dodge RPGs. You can't really dodge bullets.

Quoted

Also, the argument "if i wanted realism, i'd play ARMA" is dangerous because BF4 doesn't have to be a completely different game in every way just because it has a different title. Why can't it have some somewhat realistic aspects?
I'm not saying Battlefield has to be unlike ArmA. I'm just saying it's an unrealistic game and that therefore arguments based around realism are more-or-less moot. Gameplay should trump realism when the two come into conflict.

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What I do know is that killtrading is an integral part of physics-simulated projectiles and that the people who think otherwise clearly don't know how physics works.
It's a game, not the Large Hadron Collider. If we wanted realistic physics, bullet velocities would be doubled and the force of gravity would always be 9.81m/s2.

ToTheSun!

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128

Tuesday, February 3rd 2015, 1:38am

Gameplay should trump realism when the two come into conflict.

You're ignoring the comments that were made in relation to kill trading and ping differences.

NoctyrneSAGA

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129

Tuesday, February 3rd 2015, 1:51am

It's a game, not the Large Hadron Collider. If we wanted realistic physics, bullet velocities would be doubled and the force of gravity would always be 9.81m/s2.


And those values have been adjusted to suit gameplay.

Why should vanishing bullets that are already in flight be a thing?
Data Browser

Passive Spotting is the future!

With this, I'll rid MGO3 of infestation. Sans bad gameplay MGO3 will be torn asunder. And then it shall be free. People will suffer, of course - a phantom pain.

Reddit and Konami will rewrite the records... And I will be demonized in human memory. But... The thirst for good gameplay that I have planted will infest MGO3. No one can stop it now. The Rebalance Mod will unleash that thirst unto the future.


Are you a scrub?

If it flies, it dies™.

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130

Tuesday, February 3rd 2015, 2:24am

Gameplay should trump realism when the two come into conflict.

And yet no such conflict has been perceived in this community.

Kill trading is an automatic, unavoidable, unintended side effect of having a relatively slow game engine and particle bullets.

If you don't want kill trading, you need instahit-raycast bullets and a fast game engine. I wouldn't want raycast bullets (or 360 snipering to widen the ray cone...).

All computer games are discretized (FPS anyone) but a game could keep track of within-frame latencies and pings and thereby appear to operate with unlimited time resolution. This appears to be something that DICE didn't see essential in BF4. I wouldn't either.
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