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Aenonar

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51

Saturday, September 29th 2012, 1:53pm

What about reducing the bolt times for the bolt-actions by ~.25s each without the SPB and keeping SPB time the same? It's still faster than not using one.

This would also serve to buff all of the bolt-actions, which are sorely in need of some love.

I love this idea ^^

I do not.

While I agree that sniper rifles need some kind of buff I don't want a higher RoF for them. Accuracy is meant to be rewarded with those rifles, shooting faster just makes the punishment for not aiming for the head (when posible) lower.

Now, I'm not saying every sniper should be mountain sniping, but there's no deterrement for that kind of players. Current rifles have exaggerated bullet drop and low muzzle velocities. The ammo limits are also over the top. I feel that an increase in bolt time and muzzle velocity, along with a severé reduction to the ammuntion carried will make the Recon rifles more capable of fast shots at range, which will be "easier" given the higher muzzle velocity but the lack of ammo and slower cycle time will make a player need to make his shots count, while at the same time a need to keep itself relatively close (I for one snipe with a M40 + PSO-1 at 50-120m from the squad, will only equip x8 if baselock on carrier) so that a guy in a hill spamming his ammo will find itself in scarcity in relatively short time.

This is of course in a perfect world which is great on paper, but you can't den that current rifles kinda suck even at range with the puny muzzle velocities. I know this is also a bit OT but SPB isn't anywhere close to needing a nerf, but the rifles althogher do need some tweaks.


Sniper rifles are one of the few weapons that actually have real world gravity. It's all the other weapons that are exaggerated with their near halved gravity... All bullet speeds are about cut in half though, it's all for playability..

increasing bolt speed and reducing bullet count would just nerf recon even more, which is the last thing they need.. Increasing bullet speed wouldn't compensate that at all, it would just make recons more annoying to play since you have to go find a friendly support all the time, even if you are good. You'd have to seriously increase the damage to make it all worth it, which would just cause massive whining from everyone else

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52

Saturday, September 29th 2012, 2:05pm

No, because using a SPB sacrifices the Bipod's no-sway and recoil bonuses, which is really helpful when aiming for headshots.

Besides, bolt-actions suck horribly already. Why nerf them?

Exactly.

This post by "Requisix" (Saturday, September 29th 2012, 2:10pm) has been deleted by user "Autosynthesis" (Saturday, September 29th 2012, 2:43pm) with the following reason: What happened to the ban?

Watcher-45

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54

Saturday, September 29th 2012, 10:23pm

What's the point of the SPB if it doesn't reduce bolt time? That's exactly what it does IRL as well... If the SPB didn't noticeable reduce bolt time you could just as well run with bipod just in case you want to do a perfectly stable long range shot (not that you really need that either, learn to hold your breath?! oO )

No.
I'm sorry, but I feel compelled to pick this apart.

The "straight pull bolt" doesn't exist as a modification for any rifle in real life. There are very few "bolt action" rifles that exists with a "straight pull bolt". One example is the Swiss K-31 and it's variants, which was a trench rifle.

The closest thing I can compare the BF3 "SPB" to is just a polished bolt. The description that DICE offers simply states that it allows you to chamber another round without having to first zoom out.

It has nothing to do with ROF, and it does not reduce bolt time. All it does is exactly what it is described to do and let you stay in scope.


The added bonus "increase in ROF" is at most an increase in accurate ROF. Being in scope while manipulating bolt allows you to keep track of a moving target a little easier, so an accurate followup shot is quicker to obtain.
It doesn't make the weapon shoot faster, it makes you as the shooter able to aim and fire accurately quicker.

It is a change in weapon ergonomics, not weapon performance. It makes the shooter more capable, not the weapon better. I'm all for it.
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This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Watcher-45" (Sep 29th 2012, 10:32pm)


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55

Monday, October 1st 2012, 3:00pm


It doesn't make the weapon shoot faster, it makes you as the shooter able to aim and fire accurately quicker.
.


False, it in practice does make the ROF higher. The need to scope out when not using a straight pull bolt is a factor in the entirety of the cycle.
The need to fully unscope to begin the cyclic process means that time spent unscoping is time not spent extracting and chambering a new round.
This is especially important and significant for 8x/12x scope users who have especially long aim and deshouldering times.
Sure the process of hand on bolt to hand off bolt doesn't change but the time it takes between shot fired for him to getting his hand on the bolt is a factor.

As for straight pulls, they're common in competitive shooting. Do a biathlon or two and you'll see plenty of both.
Only reason they're not commonly used in the military is because of the bad history with them. They require a lot of upkeep, almost as much as a pistol but with more complexity so harder to clean.
Canadians armed their entire forces with Ross rifles straight pulls before the mud and filth forced them to switch to lee-enfields.
Basically? Straight pulls are a plenty. And with the creative license that BF3 has in "oh but reliability, can't suppress these weapons and etc etc issues don't matter here" I think some straight pulls aren't out of the question.





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Lennox 203

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56

Monday, October 1st 2012, 4:59pm

that gun in the 2nd video is super sexy.

If a SPB made the bolt cycle faster on top of removing the descope, Bolt actions would be to deadly (on PC especially). Churning out 1-round kills from 0-90meters. Sure pump-slugs is better up close, but a SPB BA would dominate at almost all ranges
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Nick 30075

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57

Monday, October 1st 2012, 5:20pm

that gun in the 2nd video is super sexy.

If a SPB made the bolt cycle faster on top of removing the descope, Bolt actions would be to deadly (on PC especially). Churning out 1-round kills from 0-90meters. Sure pump-slugs is better up close, but a SPB BA would dominate at almost all ranges

I mean, that's exactly what it does now.
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58

Monday, October 1st 2012, 5:22pm

that gun in the 2nd video is super sexy.

If a SPB made the bolt cycle faster on top of removing the descope, Bolt actions would be to deadly (on PC especially). Churning out 1-round kills from 0-90meters. Sure pump-slugs is better up close, but a SPB BA would dominate at almost all ranges

You make sniping sound easier than it is.

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59

Monday, October 1st 2012, 7:24pm

Sorry Nick, but in my opinion you're asking for one of the SPB's key features to be gutted. I feel that the effective ROF increase is intentional and have always considered this to be one of the merits of the attachment. The bipod's merit is the lack of scope sway, which is a double bonus as it means you're not rushed to take your steadied shot (due to the timer on normal scope steadying) and that you will rescope aiming where you were previously. Considering scope steadying was also nerfed so you have to stay still anyway I think more nerfs to the SPB are unnecessary.

To be perfectly honest I think, considering how the ability to stay mobile is so important, that most attachments will beat the bipod in general circumstances, and so using the bipod as a balancing point for these weapons can have disastrous results. For example, in my opinion the foregrip nerf made the attachment nigh unusable in most circumstances as the multiplicative spread penalty makes weapon with already high moving spread even worse, meaning the attachment designed for more mobile setups actually makes you worse at performing on the move and is thus useless (the ONLY weapons which I think benefit from a foregrip are the F2000, MTAR-21 and FAMAS- I've found even the A-91 is better off without it, and with further testing may decide to drop it from those as well).

I vote strongly against this proposal. I think all it will do is further the weapon imbalance in this game towards Assault Rifles.
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60

Thursday, October 4th 2012, 2:59am


It doesn't make the weapon shoot faster, it makes you as the shooter able to aim and fire accurately quicker.
.


False, it in practice does make the ROF higher. The need to scope out when not using a straight pull bolt is a factor in the entirety of the cycle.
The need to fully unscope to begin the cyclic process means that time spent unscoping is time not spent extracting and chambering a new round.
This is especially important and significant for 8x/12x scope users who have especially long aim and deshouldering times.
Sure the process of hand on bolt to hand off bolt doesn't change but the time it takes between shot fired for him to getting his hand on the bolt is a factor.
Allow me to counter this by saying that the bolt animation happens as soon as you leave the scope view. You don't de-scope, manipulate the bolt, then re-scope making de-scope and re-scope time a factor. You de-scope and during this you manipulate the bolt. Re-scope time might be a factor (all 3/10ths of a second of it :rolleyes: ), but any skilled player can re-enter scope and fire very quickly. As I said, the mobile recons in BC2 didn't seem to have trouble doing this. The time lost by the "enter scope" time is negligible, in my opinion. Effectively, the in-scope ROF changes very little, but since you stay in scope with the SPB the accurate ROF increases since you don't have to re-acquire target.

Practical ROF increase, and THAT is the point I am trying to express. Seems to me people are more bent on "it increases the ROF, it's like making the G3 shoot 900rpm!" when that is severely not the case. It'd be more comparable to allowing the M16 the ability to reload while ADS. Doesn't increase the volume of fire you can achieve, just allows you to stay on target in between shooting...




I am all for the SPB. As a practical device to increase weapon handling it does it's job as advertised, and countered to the bipod for bush-wookies I think it has solid competition. I don't like staying still while sniping, even at extreme range, so I almost exclusively use the SPB. The bi-pod definitely has it's place, though.




But all in all lets not forget the disadvantage to the SPB. Yes! You read right!

Ever see a horse with blinders on?

A magnified scope effectively cuts off all peripheral vision of the player. I've "snuck up" on "snipers" nearly head-on and gotten knife take-downs because they were off in their own little sniping world, staring down a drain pipe, dead set on taking down that one person whose name they've carved on a bullet.
I use the SPB almost exclusively but that doesn't mean I actually am in scope almost exclusively. In an urban environment I'm constantly in and out of ADS, the SPB's ability to deliver a quick followup shot is it's greatest advantage and as far as I'm concerned that is it's only advantage!
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