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  • "NYrecon" started this thread

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: Jan 28th 2012

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Sunday, February 5th 2012, 11:46am

Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

Am I the only one who feels this way?

Or, there's hidden factors that make a few sniper rifles unique?

Basically, there're 4 groups of sniper rifles.

Group 1

SKS (provides the fastest ROF and carries 20 rounds)

Group 2

M98B (provides the fastest and strongest Bullet)

Group 3

Semi-auto Sniper Rifles (SVD, MK11, M39 EMR and QBU-88)

Group 4

Bolt Action Rifles (SV98, M40A5, L96)


Yes. I'm aware that there are SUBTLE difference between rifles in Group 3 and 4.

In Group 3, MK11 has the fastest reload time. M39 has the fastest bullet which beats MK11 and QBU by
20m/s. ONLY 20m/s. QBU has a unique character, though. Its suppressing effect is 7% which means that your target might not notice when he has been shot at by a sniper rifle. ...OK, THAT'S IT???

Who uses SVD anyway? (...I do actually. Because it looks cool.)
Was SVD given the fastest aim-down the sight time secretly?

In Group 4, the differences between SV98 and M40A5 make sense ONLY IF there are several other bolt action rifles available. The differences are this.

SV98's shot to shot time 1.25sec M40A5's shot to shot time 1.1sec
SV98's Bullet speed 520m/s. M40A5's bullet speed 490m/s

SERIOUSLY? THAT'S IT?

Then, it was decided. We were given L96 which does shot to shot 1.1sec and velocity of 540m/s
It's just better than those 2 above.
I understand that balancing rifles for Assault Class wasn't so difficult. They gave different ROF and firing mode to each gun. I think that the balance between PDWs is brilliant.

Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

Time to time, we see a topic like "The Best Support Gun" or "The Best Assault Rifle"
All the mature and intellectual players know that it's nonsense.
A player should select a weapon that could provide the best possible result in a given task and situation.

There is NO "better weapon"... ...oh, no, THERE IS!!!!

L96 IS THE BEST. SVD users are SUCKERS. Go to Symthic.com.

I truly respect Dice and the people who created this great game but seriously?
They though we wouldn't find out about this?

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Sunday, February 5th 2012, 12:36pm

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

You're exaggerating.
The only weapon that has nothing known going for it is the SVD, but this is the case with all russian starter weapons, strange no one gets mad about that ...

THE QBU-88 gets -33% vertical -33% horizontal recoil from foregrip, so it is the weapon with the least recoil from that group.

The L96 has a rather odd reload animation if you stay scoped in with straight pull bolt, and if you use an ACOG it is even glitched. I use the M40 with it.

SV98 is the first bolt rifle and it can take quite some time to get the other ones, so it's not that useless, especially considering you need to unlock all the attachments again which is quite tiresome for bolt and the difference being really slim.


But yeah it's no difference difference between them all.

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Sunday, February 5th 2012, 2:35pm

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

You're forgetting that for a player that knows how to snipe and consistently get headshots, it will never matter what sniper rifle you pick when it comes to bolt actions. It's a class of weapons that don't need "flavor." I don't snipe often but I've always preferred the M40 over the others even though according to stats it's supposedly a downgrade from the L96 and frankly, I could not care any less. When you use a weapon enough, you learn its quirks and judging drop and how to lead your shots become second nature. Even if a sniper has better stats than another one, all that will matter is the skill of the person behind it and naturally, a person who is more familiar with a SV98 will beat a person of equal skill but with a M98B they never used a lot more often.

The flavor of the Recon kit in general comes from the different TYPES of snipers: Semi-Auto, Bolt Action, and the SKS. There really isn't a kit with this sort of variety within a group of weapons (except maybe Support, since the M27/RPK function like assault rifles compared to the traditional LMG's.) The bolt actions are high damage with a lot of range and accuracy, but their limited rate of fire makes them an unattractive option for aggressive play, whereas semi-autos are the opposite and lack the high damage at long range but have excellent rates of fire to make them much more desirable in situations where the bolt actions wouldn't excel. The SKS is the odd-one-out simply because it blurs the line between the assault rifles/LMG's and the sniper rifles with lower, but consistent damage and a high magazine making it a unique example.

Aenonar

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Sunday, February 5th 2012, 3:44pm

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

Well, I don't use semi snipers, don't really see the point of single shot if you can't kill with it...


As for bolts, SV98 is a good starter, but the M40 has better damage and reload, bullet speed feels great as well.

M40, excellent bolt sniper for headshots.

L96, I don't really like it, the bullet speed doesn't feel right for me, I prefer the M40 instead. Plus the empty reload is 0.8 seconds slower oO

But the all round favorite is just the M98B... Can engage far more targets than any other... The only things that annoy me is the "low" damage and 5round clip, although that's manageable..

But yeah, what can you do with bolt action other than speed, reload and clip size? They will all be 1 hit kills in the head, and spread/recoil is useless...


As for semi's, you have 5 different ones to chose from, although M39 and Mk11 are up top.

As for the SKS... You're forgetting that it has a 20 round magazine and highest suppressed bullet speed : / Bipod spread is also different

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: Jan 19th 2012

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Sunday, February 5th 2012, 7:30pm

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

I believe that the bolt actions are sufficiently different. Little things like bolt animation time, reload speed, and bullet velocity help each rifle have a slightly different 'feel'.

I do agree that semi-auto snipers need some differentiation, maybe with regards to certain attachments? (Like how the QBU is the only one to get a flash hider) There could be one that does better on the move (see ADS movement speed), one with better hipfire, etc.

I would enjoy another SKS 'class' gun, maybe a carbine FN FAL or something.

Nick 30075

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Sunday, February 5th 2012, 9:39pm

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

Use all of the weapons in the same group, but with the same setup. You'll see subtle differences between all of them. For example, which bolt-action has the end of the barrel nearest the center of the screen? This matters when quickscoping. That's a kind of strange difference but it's highly relevant. What about predictability of recoil? The QBU feels the best to me, but they all have different feels.

Groups:
1) SKS--I love this thing, almost at my fifth star with it, the only one I can successfully use aggressively since I'm on Xbox and I don't have OHK snipers.

2) M98B--I use it for medium-range sniping. Which I suck at. Took me forever to get my second star on it. 7x and other stuff.

3) QBU88, SVD, MK11, M39--I have them all configured differently and pick between them for different situations. I like having four, I can set them up differently.
QBU88--Kobra, Grip, Suppressor--just trolling around, going for headshots.
SVD--I don't like the faction switching (I forget to switch back), otherwise this'd be my main one instead of the QBU. I love the iron sights. I'd set up my QBU with a 4x instead and just use this like that.
MK11--Medium range triple-tapping. 8x, Foregrip, whatever. Don't use it much due to faction switching.
M39--Anti-sniper weapon of choice. 12x, Bipod, whatever.

4) M40, L96, SV98
I run the PSO-1 (Russian 4x), Straight-pull bolt, Laser or Flashlight on all of them. I have the most success with the SV98, but I've started using the L96 recently and I like it again.
I hate the Acog in this game, so I've had a hard time using the M40 since I don't have it yet (got it with the L96 while using a Holo, it was rather painfully difficult). I'll use a 3.4x on everything but a bolt-action because I can't reliably headshot with a 3.4x. Have to use a 4x, and I strongly dislike that Acog.

Basically, once we get OHK snipers, I'll use all of the bolt-actions a bit more. If the faction-specific weapons didn't swap places between games, I'd use all of them, but in different roles. I rather like the subtle differences, it lets me use different setups on all of them and I can switch between different guns for different roles instead of having to take a minute or two to setup the same weapon when I need it to fill a different role.
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Monday, February 6th 2012, 2:41pm

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

Like pointed out above, I think the bolt actions are all about feel. If you look at the stats the M98B should be the hands down best bolt action, but my accuracy (34.7%) and headshot/kill ratio (59 out of 143 kills with it are from headshots) with it is the lowest by a far margin vs the other bolt actions. I don't know what it is but with a standard sniper setup (8X + optics, bipod) I just have a hard time judging my shots with the M98B. But with the L96 I have greater accuracy by a large margin (10.4% more than the M98B) and all but two of my kills with it are from head shots. It just seems to fit better with me.


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Sunday, February 12th 2012, 1:23am

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

Quoted from ""Aenonar""

Well, I don't use semi snipers, don't really see the point of single shot if you can't kill with it...



i know this is an old topic, but i'd just like to comment on this, the point with semi-auto sniper is that if you pull off a headshot, its a 2 shot kill, and if you dont, its a three shot kill.
compare that to the L96/M40, where they offer a "one-shot-one-kill"-deal, but if you miss that first shot, there is often not time enough to get that second shot in for the kill

(and before you go all "you dont know what you're talking about" on me, check out my battlelog: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf3/soldier/Zargoon/weapons/322023507/pc/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf3/so ... 023507/pc/</a><!-- m --> )

i have 2210 kills with the L95/M40, and 1655 with the M39/QBU, i am highly successful with the L96, with an accuracy at about 47% with the majority of the kills being headshots.

and my personal conclusion is that i have a higher DPS output on the semi sniper than on a bolt rifle, mainly because i can fire at anyone anywhere and be quite certain to get a kill, cause i get get off 3 shots in about 2 seconds, but if i dont get the headshot with a bolt rifle, in pretty sure that i will loose my target, or that he will spot me before i get the second shot in, i know its the same amount of time between the shots, but if the target is moving, ill have to spend a fraction of a second with the bolt before i fire the second one.

Another thing is that if you get hit with shots that come within a half of a second of each other you have a harder time at firing back, than if you get hit with one shot, and then you have a second to react/aim and fire.

bottom line is. i feel that i have a higher probability of getting kills with a semi, than a bolt in my hand, even though my accuracy might be a bit lower.

as for the difference, i agree that you're best at what you have learnt to play with, im best with the L96 since ive gotten so many kills with it, and really learnt the bullet speed, and can take that in to account when leading the target or compensate bullet drop. I have such a harder time hitting with the M98 even though its faster.

As for the Semis, i used to play with the M39 cause it looked way cooler than the other, but right now, i feel as the QBU has way to many upsides to even consider the others ( foregrip decreasing vertical recoil, and not just horizontal and flash suppressor)

  • "NYrecon" started this thread

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Sunday, February 12th 2012, 10:26pm

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

Thanks for an intellectual comment, Zargon.

I was expecting to see more angry people ranting about this.

Guess not. -8D-

I'm a bit of weapon freak. I have more than 100 kills with all the weapons.
I mean ALL of them except stinger, iga and some pistols.
More than 300 kills with all the sniper rifles. +500 kills with EMR, M98 and SV98.

I've spent quite some time on this website studying all the weapon because it interests me much.

Yes, I do know QBU's flat shooting characteristic. I'm well aware of the subtle differences and do enjoy "the feel" of each sniper rifles.

Each sniper rifle is set up differently to make a quick deployment possible so that I don't have to change attachment on a particular rifle I'm going to use before spawning in. For instance, I have IRNV on SVD since rare occasions call for the use of IRNV for me.(The forest in Caspian Border is one.)

I know what I'm talking about.

Let me talk about the PDWs for the sake of this topic.
They way they balance the PDWs is absolutely brilliant.(*I play HC mode exclusively.)

P90 and MP7 with extended mag really shines, when It comes to extreme CQB, like where you literally run into an enemy soldier. Its hipshooting accuracy and the high ROF gives a shooter the fastest engagement time without aiming down the sight.

Not all conflicts happen in close range. When you expect mid range battles, UMP, PP-2000 and PDW-R suit your mission better. It seems that PP-2000 with extended mag(40 rounds and slightly higher ROF) has a clear advantage over UMP. BUT, you have to give up silencer attachment in order to use extended mag. PDW-R has the highest ROF(750rpm) of the 3. Again, with silencer, You'll get only 20 rounds when you can have 25 rounds with a silenced UMP.

The same goes with MP7 with extended mag. P90 can perform stealth capability with a 50 rounds mag when MP7 with extended mag(40 rounds) can't but It can provide slightly less reload time and flatter shooting characteristic.

"You can't have it all", huh? I see, I love it and hate it.

Back to the original subject, in BF3, we were given so many sniper rifles to enjoy. In the old game like 2142, you can choose 3 weapons to choose from which were a standard issue with 5 rounds, a more powerful rifle with 3 rounds and one PDW as recon class. If there is no practical reason(other than velocity) to choose one sniper rifle from the others, you have to admit that there's no element of selecting "the right equipment" in a given situation. Not to mention, to train your eyes to a certain velocity only makes you stick with one that you have confidence with.
Top of that, Tossing "Oh, no, you CAN have it all" weapon(L96) in the arsenal makes this matter worse.

Kicking back and say, "enjoy the feel to it."?

NO. I disagree.(I kinda do, the looks wise.)
A few of my friends had no knowledge about the weapon stats and blindly believed the weapon descriptions on the web. Ignorance is bliss?

I don't see a lesser weapon like SVD in any other classes.
I also don't see any clear winner like L96.

I see it as one of a few bad decisions that they made.

MAKE EACH RIFLE DIFFERENT. GIVE EACH GUN ADVANTAGES AND DISADVANTAGES.

Bolt action:
SV98 given x6 scope.
M40 given the fastest velocity with silencer.
L96 given only 7 rounds.

Thought of this on the spot. Easy.

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Tuesday, February 14th 2012, 9:14am

Re: Why are the Sniper Rifles so FLAVORLESS?

I really was disappointed when there was no .50BMG or anti-material rifles. I really wanted to punch some thumb-holes in a tank.
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