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Jet

InternationalGamer

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31

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 1:08am

Hate to do the bump, but can we get a consensus here on the ideal turn speed?

I've heard 280, 285, 310, 300 and a lot of other speeds, and honestly I'm just confused at this point.

I also have a sneaking suspicion that the F35 has a different ideal turn speed from the sukhov and the hornet, and those are also different from the CAS jets.

Also, as far as the swaying sideways when turning to reduce distance trick goes, I assume you attempt to maintain the ideal turn speed while doing this, whatever that may be?

280 would be ideal, but it's hard to stay at exactly 280 and underneath means losing control.. Anywhere between 280 and 310 is pretty much identical anyways...

And yes, the sideways motion is basically to increase the distance your jet travels, so to the enemy looking at the minimap it looks like you're still turning like normal, but moving extremely slowly, and lets you get on their tail

Are you sure Aeronar?
I am fairly certain that 305-310 seems to be the best for turning, my jets turning speed greatly decreases at 280, infact, the jets turning speed is seriously effected at a speed below 300 and above 310.
Even the post that the top of this page suggested the same thing.
But, it might be Console PC differences.

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32

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 4:42am

Top tip: turn at 310 and Bob's your uncle.

Aenonar

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33

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 9:20am

Hate to do the bump, but can we get a consensus here on the ideal turn speed?

I've heard 280, 285, 310, 300 and a lot of other speeds, and honestly I'm just confused at this point.

I also have a sneaking suspicion that the F35 has a different ideal turn speed from the sukhov and the hornet, and those are also different from the CAS jets.

Also, as far as the swaying sideways when turning to reduce distance trick goes, I assume you attempt to maintain the ideal turn speed while doing this, whatever that may be?

280 would be ideal, but it's hard to stay at exactly 280 and underneath means losing control.. Anywhere between 280 and 310 is pretty much identical anyways...

And yes, the sideways motion is basically to increase the distance your jet travels, so to the enemy looking at the minimap it looks like you're still turning like normal, but moving extremely slowly, and lets you get on their tail

Are you sure Aeronar?
I am fairly certain that 305-310 seems to be the best for turning, my jets turning speed greatly decreases at 280, infact, the jets turning speed is seriously effected at a speed below 300 and above 310.
Even the post that the top of this page suggested the same thing.
But, it might be Console PC differences.

280 is the cutoff value for when jets lose all maneuverability, so if you dip below 280 you lose a helluva lot of maneuverability and it's pretty hard to stay at 280-285 without dipping below. And I seriously doubt Dice did anything but a linear turn/speed equation just to make 310 the ideal turning speed, plus I've never experienced anything negative from going at 285 vs 300, the actual maneuvers are far more important than a minor difference of 285 vs 310. The only really important thing is that you don't dip below 280.

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34

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 10:02am

I also have noticed having higher sensitivity will allow you to hit harder turns. Think about it...it's a big one.

*Edit: Time to test? Try circling around Caspian Border Antenna Tower and test speeds. Make a low shot and post screenshots record 4-8 points of that circle and plot them. Whatever has the tightest we should generally see which one is the best.

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Aenonar

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35

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 10:19am

I also have noticed having higher sensitivity will allow you to hit harder turns. Think about it...it's a big one.

*Edit: Time to test? Try circling around Caspian Border Antenna Tower and test speeds. Make a low shot and post screenshots record 4-8 points of that circle and plot them. Whatever has the tightest we should generally see which one is the best.
I'll see what I can find.. I've tested the F35 vs Su-37 turning radius before, though it's always hard to track exactly how big the difference is... Figured out a new way to test it that hopefully will give an accurate enough result to spot the difference...

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(14:06:57) Riesig: I should stop now. People might get sig material again

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36

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 10:23am

Ic, nice. Well instead of turning around the Antenna, fly towards the antenna and right when you pass/almost hit the antenna then start turning. That should give a nice point of reference.

^ My [Gun Lover's] Sig (Type It In): 945k+ Hits! // Still Fixing KDR... // Current KDR Avg: 2.5~3.0
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Aenonar

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37

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 11:47am

Realized that I haven't actually properly tested the jets throttle properly since the April patch, other than that it was "weird". The cutoff value isn't a hard 280 like it was before then, but more like a soft cutoff kicking in near 280, but you retain plenty of maneuverability even down to 240 and even 200, where you'd just fall like a rock pre-patch.


So... Accurate turning radius for jets at various speed intervals... Pixels value is just a reference for the map I tested it on (wake) since the maps zoom varies depending on map and settings.

Used the Su-37, and got the data by frapsing the speed+minimap position and entirely focusing on keeping the speed + the plane leveled, worked perfectly :)

193-196 - avg ~194 - 15.600 s - 122px lap
277-293 - avg ~288 - 6.600 s - 76px lap
298-306 - avg ~300 - 6.099 s - 73px lap
306-317 - avg ~311 - 5.766 s - 71px lap
316-326 - avg ~320 - 6.700 s - 82px lap
335-345 - avg ~338 - 8.033 s - 105px lap (max throttle)
418-421 - avg ~420 - 10.330 s - 173px lap (afterburner)

So the ideal turning speed is around 310


And as a comparison since they claim they've fixed the turning radius for the F35:

198-202 - avg ~200 - 16.800 s - 135px lap

305-317 - avg ~312 - 6.566 s - 82px lap

338-342 - avg ~340 - 9.266 s - 129px lap (max throttle)

So... The Su-37 still turns tighter than the F35... And now there's definite proof...



CAS jet:
185-200 - avg ~191 - 13.933 s - 222px lap
278-293 - avg ~288 - 6.733 s - 148px lap
295-311 - avg ~305 - 5.733 s - 143px lap
340-347 - avg ~346 - 8.633 s - 222px lap (max throttle)

And there is no afterburner on the CAS jets (I could swear there used to be one though.. D: ) so keeping the speed consistent was pretty tricky... It was far easier to control the speed at ~290 than 300+. There you basically had to do about 80% power 20% idle, but very fast... :> 290 was about 50/50 but fast

But what can be concluded is that CAS jets prefer about the same speed as the jets, around 305-310




Jet acceleration and deceleration:


Fighter:

Acceleration:
210 -> 345 : 6.933s

210 -> 420 : 5.767s (afterburner)
346 -> 420 : 3.333s (afterburner)

Deceleration:
346 -> 210 : 7.667s
420 -> 210 : 7.067s
420 -> 350 : 4.100s


F35:

Acceleration:
50 -> 220 : 4.066s (hover mode)
220 -> 344 : 5.967s

50 -> 220 : 3.033 (hover mode + afterburner)
220 -> 420 : 5.900s (afterburner)
343 -> 420 : 3.433s (afterburner)

Deceleration:
220 -> 50 : 7.200s (hover mode)
346 -> 220 : 4.233s (hover mode engages)

220 -> 51 : 8.600s (from afterburner)
420 -> 220 : 4.367s
420 -> 347 : 4.533


Ground attack:

Acceleration:
210 -> 345 : 6.500s

Deceleration:
346 -> 210 : 7.533s

Note that the ground attack jets do not have any afterburner!

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(14:06:57) Riesig: I should stop now. People might get sig material again

This post has been edited 6 times, last edit by "Aenonar" (Jul 17th 2012, 10:23am)


InternationalGamer

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38

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 12:44pm

Realized that I haven't actually properly tested the jets throttle properly since the April patch, other than that it was "weird". The cutoff value isn't a hard 280 like it was before then, but more like a soft cutoff kicking in near 280, but you retain plenty of maneuverability even down to 240 and even 200, where you'd just fall like a rock pre-patch.


So... Accurate turning radius for jets at various speed intervals... Pixels value is just a reference for the map I tested it on (wake) since the maps zoom varies depending on map and settings.

Used the Su-37, and got the data by frapsing the speed+minimap position and entirely focusing on keeping the speed + the plane leveled, worked perfectly :)

193-196 - avg ~194 - 15.600 s - 122px lap
277-293 - avg ~288 - 6.600 s - 76px lap
298-306 - avg ~300 - 6.099 s - 73px lap
306-317 - avg ~311 - 5.766 s - 71px lap
316-326 - avg ~320 - 6.700 s - 82px lap
335-345 - avg ~338 - 8.033 s - 105px lap (max throttle)
418-421 - avg ~420 - 10.330 s - 173px lap (afterburner)

So the ideal turning speed is around 310


And as a comparison since they claim they've fixed the turning radius for the F35:

198-202 - avg ~200 - 16.800 s - 135px lap

305-317 - avg ~312 - 6.566 s - 82px lap

338-342 - avg ~340 - 9.266 s - 129px lap (max throttle)

So... The Su-37 still turns tighter than the F35... And now there's definite proof...
It's the Su-35 by the way.

Anyways, I can see the Su-35 having a better turning radius, the F-35 has other advantages such as hovering and after the large March or April patch, controlling the F-35 in hover is much easier now.
I was able to get behind many jets by just hovering behind the carrier and I was invisible on their Air Radar since I hovered at a very low altitude.

Aenonar

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39

Saturday, June 16th 2012, 3:06pm

It's the Su-35 by the way.
Always get them confused since they're both codenamed flanker -.-'

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40

Sunday, June 17th 2012, 1:03am

Realized that I haven't actually properly tested the jets throttle properly since the April patch, other than that it was "weird". The cutoff value isn't a hard 280 like it was before then, but more like a soft cutoff kicking in near 280, but you retain plenty of maneuverability even down to 240 and even 200, where you'd just fall like a rock pre-patch.


So... Accurate turning radius for jets at various speed intervals... Pixels value is just a reference for the map I tested it on (wake) since the maps zoom varies depending on map and settings.

Used the Su-37, and got the data by frapsing the speed+minimap position and entirely focusing on keeping the speed + the plane leveled, worked perfectly :)

193-196 - avg ~194 - 15.600 s - 122px lap
277-293 - avg ~288 - 6.600 s - 76px lap
298-306 - avg ~300 - 6.099 s - 73px lap
306-317 - avg ~311 - 5.766 s - 71px lap
316-326 - avg ~320 - 6.700 s - 82px lap
335-345 - avg ~338 - 8.033 s - 105px lap (max throttle)
418-421 - avg ~420 - 10.330 s - 173px lap (afterburner)

So the ideal turning speed is around 310


And as a comparison since they claim they've fixed the turning radius for the F35:

198-202 - avg ~200 - 16.800 s - 135px lap

305-317 - avg ~312 - 6.566 s - 82px lap

338-342 - avg ~340 - 9.266 s - 129px lap (max throttle)

So... The Su-37 still turns tighter than the F35... And now there's definite proof...


This is actually very interesting finds. I always felt that the 310 speed felt optimum from lots of jet hours, but it seems from your data one more thing can be said: if you can't maintain the 310 speed at all times for whatever reason, it's better to be a bit slower rather than faster. 82 pixels/lap @ 320 compared to 73 pixels/lap @ 300.

Anyways, just wanted to say good findings. finally some solid numbers to work with, thank you.