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J0hn-Stuart-Mill

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Friday, April 20th 2012, 2:25pm

Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server patch)

On April 19th, a server side patch was released that re-balanced nearly every tank damage number. This post began as a breakdown of the changes, but now will be an ongoing list of current tank values. I will continue and edit this first post with new info as needed.

This post updated June 3rd to consolidate all thread data into this first post in preparation for the CQ release and any gameplay balances or bug fixes that might occur. Any such changes discovered or observed should be posted in this thread and I will update the OP as needed.

Tanks are still disabled at 50%.
Proximity Sensor (perk) - 20 meter radius, detects players moving or stationary
Proximity Sensor (from CITV seat) - 20 meter radius, detects players moving or stationary
T-UGS - 30 meters, and does not detect motionless players, nor players moving while crouched

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Legend:
Weapon fired at tank: CURRENT VALUE - ( MARCH PATCH VALUE )
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Tank main cannon perpendicular to the front: 24* - (30)
Tank main cannon perpendicular to the side: 48 - (55)
Tank main cannon perpendicular to the rear: 75 - (83)
With Reactive Armor: Zero (up to one hit per side)
* Subject to Hit Detection Bug #1 (below)

Tank Guided Shell perpendicular to the front: 41 - (41)
Tank Guided Shell perpendicular to the side: 41 - (41)
Tank Guided Shell perpendicular to the rear: 41 - (41)
With reactive armor: zero (up to one hit per side)
Tank Guided Shell with SOFLAM designation: 71 - (80)

SMAW/RPG perpendicular to the front: 22 - (22)
SMAW/RPG perpendicular to the side: 45 - (41)
SMAW/RPG perpendicular to the rear: 55 - (71)
With Reactive Armor: Zero (up to one hit per side)

Javelin perpendicular to the front: 48 - (50)
Javelin perpendicular to the side: 52 - (58 )
Javelin perpendicular to the rear: 65 - (67)
Javelin with SOFLAM: 71 - (71) (movement appears to result in a few slightly lower numbers)
With Reactive Armor: (Both with SOFLAM designation and without): usually zero, but sometimes 8-20 for the first shot, BUT sometimes a javelin removes multiple side's reactive armor.

TV Missile perpendicular to the front: 61** - (100)
TV Missile perpendicular to the side: 61** - (100)
TV Missile perpendicular to the rear: 61** - (100)
TV Missile perpendicular to the top: 45-65***
With Reactive Armor: Zero, BUT it takes the reactive armor from the OPPOSITE side being fired at. (sometimes multiple sides armor is taken)
** Subject to Hit Detection Bug #2 (below)
*** Subject to Hit Detection Bug #3 (below)

Heli Guided Missile perpendicular to the front: 48
Heli Guided Missile perpendicular to the side: 56
Heli Guided Missile perpendicular to the rear: 71
With Reactive Armor: Zero (up to one hit per side)
Heli Guided Missile with SOFLAM: 75 (and performs top down attack)

Jet Main Cannon (Conquest Jets) perpendicular to the front: up to 35 (full magazine of bullets with 100% hits)
Jet Main Cannon (Conquest Jets) perpendicular to the side: up to 55 (full magazine of bullets with 100% hits)
Jet Main Cannon (Conquest Jets) perpendicular to the rear: up to 75 (full magazine of bullets with 100% hits)
IMPORTANT NOTE- Unlike RPG's, jet cannon bullets don't care "where" on the tank they hit, they get the directional bonuses based on them being fired from the rear, even if they hit the turret, or the front of the tank. As long as they are fired perpendicular from the rear, every bullet can hit the front portion of the tank and still get the rear shot bonus.

Jet ATGM perpendicular to the front: 65* - (41)
Jet ATGM perpendicular to the side: 65* - (41)
Jet ATGM perpendicular to the rear: 65* - (41)
Jet ATGM vertically to the top: numbers varied wildly from 9 damage to 41 (these are shot from a steep nose dive)
Jet ATGM with SOFLAM: 65 - (41)
With Reactive Armor: zero, BUT it takes the reactive armor from the OPPOSITE side being fired at.
* Subject to Hit Detection Bugs #2 and #4 (below)

C4 anywhere on the tank - 61 damage
C4 anywhere on the tank with reactive armor - 2 packs - far less than 99 damage
C4 on IFVs and MAA to the front - 55
C4 on IFVs and MAA to the side - 55
C4 on IFVs and MAA to the rear - 58

*** UNGUIDED ROCKETS *** from Jets (Rocket Pods), Helis, as well as Heli Gunner seat "main gun" all appear unaffected by Reactive Armor, NOR do they strip reactive armor away. To state that another way, they appear to do damage to the tank, at the same rate whether reactive armor is present or not, and do not damage or remove reactive armor plating while they are damaging the tank. (This appears to be an intentional balance decision)


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Known Hit Detection Bugs
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


*1* Boosting (sprinting) forward in a tank and being shot in the front by another tank registers as a "rear" hit

**2** Many high speed rockets - (ATGM from multiple vehicles, and TV Missiles) result in a glitch that shows front shots register as "rear" hits (and do more damage) and "rear" hits register as "front" hits (and do less damage)

***3*** TV Missiles that hit tanks top down can appear to go through the tank and explode in the ground below and do zero to 10 damage.

****4**** The Jet ATGM damage was 65% about 80% of the time, randomly we'd get weird numbers anywhere from 45% to 56%. We tried every imaginable attack angle, couldn't make heads or tails. But 80% of the time it does 65 damage, and 20% of the time it's just a random number between 45-56.




Ongoing updates for this data thanks to: (data contributors to this thread)
Elite - March Patch Data values
rainkloud - ATGM bug analysis
lqud - BF3 code analysis
Aenonar - C4 Damage Values
Testing- Rezal, J35t3r, MNHClever, SpecOpsGrunty and many others- sorry if I forgot you.
My father used to say, We find our true friends on the Battlefield! - J0hn Snow

This post has been edited 12 times, last edit by "J0hn-Stuart-Mill" (Aug 1st 2012, 12:21pm)


J0hn-Stuart-Mill

GW2 N00B... also old.

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Friday, April 20th 2012, 2:48pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

New info added.
My father used to say, We find our true friends on the Battlefield! - J0hn Snow


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Friday, April 20th 2012, 3:44pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

Nice work. Would you happen to have the pre-patch numbers?
Platform: PC



Please just call me, Ike.

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Friday, April 20th 2012, 4:13pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

It looks like they increased the effectiveness of the front armor.

J0hn-Stuart-Mill

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Friday, April 20th 2012, 5:05pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

These numbers are the numbers that changed yesterday, April 19th, in a server side patch.

The "March patch" had changed them pretty severely against tanks, and so this seems to be a partial reversal of those changes

The biggest changes from these numbers are:

* TV Missile OHK glitch fixed.
* RPG shots to the rear are far weaker, and as a result, the angle needed to "two shot" a tank from the rear is greatly reduced.
* Undesignated Javelin is no longer one hit disable from the front
* Tank Main cannon can no longer one hit disable from the side, nor two hit kill from the side.
My father used to say, We find our true friends on the Battlefield! - J0hn Snow


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Friday, April 20th 2012, 5:17pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

great work, thanks.

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Friday, April 20th 2012, 5:43pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

Lol, just by testing the tank armor strength, you've discovered a nice batch of bugs.


-TV missile:
TV Missile perpendicular to the top: 45-65 (a few times it appeared to go through the tank and explode in the ground below and do zero to 10 damage)

-TV missile:
With Reactive Armor: zero, BUT it takes the reactive armor from the OPPOSITE side being fired at. (sometimes multiple sides armor is taken)

-TV missile:
Maybe it's not a bug, but usually the top of the tanks has the weakest armor in real life, so it's illogical to take less damage there

-jet ATGM:
Jet ATGM vertically to the top: numbers varied wildly from 9 damage to 41 (these are shot from a steep nose dive)

-jet ATGM
With Reactive Armor: zero, BUT it takes the reactive armor from the OPPOSITE side being fired at.
Platform: PC

"Top 0.0% in all categories, and first place in all categories, and golden medal in all categories, and I'm the bestest in all categories and oh I'm so proud of myself..."

J0hn-Stuart-Mill

GW2 N00B... also old.

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Friday, April 20th 2012, 5:52pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

Hehe, yea.

Also, the biggest bug we found was transport Heli flares CAN deflect Javelins, but it is nearly impossible to time it right. Even when the Heli pilot knows EXACTLY where the javelin is coming from, flares rarely work vs a javelin, so in normal gameplay, when the transport pilot has NO IDEA where it's coming from, say goodnight. One hit disable, and usually the javelin kills the pilot out of the cockpit, so even with repair guys, you're toast.
My father used to say, We find our true friends on the Battlefield! - J0hn Snow


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Friday, April 20th 2012, 7:22pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

Quoted from ""stalaggtIKE""

Nice work. Would you happen to have the pre-patch numbers?



Before the server side patch you mean? I have those kicking about. I'll add them in parenthesis beside J0hn's data.

I didn't test the Heli guided missile though so I cannot provide that data, I do have some things he didn't test though like the Jet Cannon and Transport Heli Gun and Heli rockets and Transport Heli Gun but I think it would be confusing to provide the outdated values without having the current ones alongside.


Tank main cannon perpendicular to the front: 24 (30)
Tank main cannon perpendicular to the side: 48 (55)
Tank main cannon perpendicular to the rear: 75 (83)
With reactive armor: zero (up to one hit per side)

Tank Guided Shell perpendicular to the front: 41 (41)
Tank Guided Shell perpendicular to the side: 41 (41)
Tank Guided Shell perpendicular to the rear: 41 (41)
With reactive armor: zero (up to one hit per side)
Tank Guided Shell with SOFLAM designation: 71 (80)

SMAW/RPG perpendicular to the front: 22 (22)
SMAW/RPG perpendicular to the side: 45 (41)
SMAW/RPG perpendicular to the rear: 55 (71)
With reactive armor: zero (up to one hit per side)

Javelin perpendicular to the front: 48 (50)
Javelin perpendicular to the side: 52 (58)
Javelin perpendicular to the rear: 65 (67)
Javelin with SOFLAM: 71 (71) (perhaps movement affects this slightly?)
With reactive armor (Both with SOFLAM designation and without): usually zero, but sometimes 8-20 for the first shot, BUT sometimes a javelin removes multiple side's reactive armor.

TV Missile perpendicular to the front: 61 (100)
TV Missile perpendicular to the side: 61 (100)
TV Missile perpendicular to the rear: 61 (100)
TV Missile perpendicular to the top: 45-65 (a few times it appeared to go through the tank and explode in the ground below and do zero to 10 damage)
With Reactive Armor: zero, BUT it takes the reactive armor from the OPPOSITE side being fired at. (sometimes multiple sides armor is taken)

Heli Guided Missile perpendicular to the front: 48
Heli Guided Missile perpendicular to the side: 56
Heli Guided Missile perpendicular to the rear: 71
With Reactive Armor: Zero
Heli Guided Missile with SOFLAM: 75 (and performs top down attack)

Jet ATGM perpendicular to the front: 65* (41)
Jet ATGM perpendicular to the side: 65* (41)
Jet ATGM perpendicular to the rear: 65* (41)
Jet ATGM vertically to the top: numbers varied wildly from 9 damage to 41 (these are shot from a steep nose dive)
Jet ATGM with SOFLAM: 65 (41)
With Reactive Armor: zero, BUT it takes the reactive armor from the OPPOSITE side being fired at.



Interesting to see that the Jet ATGM seemingly got buffed when everything else was effectively powered down. In any case I'll be happy to see the back of 1 shot javelin disables to the front.

If it matters my data was from the PS3.

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Friday, April 20th 2012, 7:34pm

Re: Tweaked tank armor strength- New Data - (April Server pa

Quoted from ""J0hn-Stuart-Mill""

Hehe, yea.

Also, the biggest bug we found was transport Heli flares CAN deflect Javelins, but it is nearly impossible to time it right. Even when the Heli pilot knows EXACTLY where the javelin is coming from, flares rarely work vs a javelin, so in normal gameplay, when the transport pilot has NO IDEA where it's coming from, say goodnight. One hit disable, and usually the javelin kills the pilot out of the cockpit, so even with repair guys, you're toast.


You might want to watch these videos, if you haven't yet. They did some extensive testing of that in there.

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