Welcome to symthic forums! We would love if you'd register!
You don't have to be expert in bit baking, everyone is more than welcome to join our community.

You are not logged in.

Hey! If this is your first visit on symthic.com, also check out our weapon damage charts.
Currently we have charts for Battlefield 3, Call of Duty: Black Ops 2, Medal of Honor: Warfighter and Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3

Failure117

cheap kitchen leeds

(76)

  • "Failure117" started this thread

Posts: 774

Date of registration
: Jun 27th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Illinois, USA

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 6

  • Send private message

1

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 5:55am

Stealth for Recon - A TL;DR by a Forumfielder

Saw this post on Battlelog. I think it's a great idea, so I thought I would share it with you guys.

Quoted from "JSLICE20"

I believe I have a genious idea regarding the recon class (and no it does not involve an increase in weapon damage or anything or the sort). Have you noticed that there is a lack of legitimate stealth in Battlefield 3? Sure there's the option to equip a suppressor to eliminate your blip on the mini-map, but for a first-person-shooter of this magnitude I believe that is hardly adequate. Many players roll with a squad of friends or platoon members, and a good portion use mics for direct communication with each other to be more effective on the battlefield. Tactics like these most often occur in Rush, particularly in defense, where the combat is more frequent and more intense which becomes increasingly difficult as an attacker on the smaller, urban focused maps. (Sometimes a defense is closely knit and difficult to breach, but there are methods to break that defensive line. On the urban locations, an attacking team usually groups up together to create a large force that is hard to destroy and when the attackers group so do the defenders to prevent the large force from overtaking them.

When this situation arises and the attacking team gains no ground, the tendency would be to try and flank from the opposite side. This is where stealth comes into play. With a stealth squad, there is an opportunity to seek and destroy enemies from their flanks and potentially arm/ destroy a neglected MCOM, catch the other enemies off-guard, and allow the rest of your attacking team to advance to the next MCOM while the defenders attempt to disarm the initial plant. The issue with this plan of attack is that stealth is not that effective at all. If you kill a player who is on comms. with his squad, a suppressor will provide no advantage. He'll alert them to your exact location and the attempted flanking maneuver will put your team to a disadvantage because that squad will now be sure to cover that lane. This set of circumstances always proves to be a loss, and no one likes to lose, so I propose this solution.

The recon class is not popular by any means in general or to an objective player so why not give it an advantage in stealth? Simply put, let's make the recon a stealth-based class and diminish it's reputation as a "camper's class." My solution would be to allow recon the ability to be excepted from a player's killcam when he stabs an enemy or he shoots the enemy with a suppressed weapon. Say you are trapped in one of the situations mentioned above. Your attacking team is in a stalemate with the defenders and you know that tactic will not prove successful. Now you and your sqadmates can equip your recon classes with suppressed PDWs, DMRs (Designated Marksman Rifles - Semi-autos), or Bolt-Action Rifles and flank the enemy by surprise without them knowing your exact whereabouts, just a general area. Stealth and surveilance are key to success in Rush and I think this simple implement could change the way Rush is played for the better.

Let's be honest, who would be opposed to this suggestion? It permits an underused, underpowered class to be useful, enjoyable and at the same time balanced. Each class allows the player a certain ability that distinguishes them from the others. Assault is provided with the ability to revive downed teammates, heal themselves and others, and they get strong assault rifles that can perform well at any range. Engineers have anti-vehicle specializations, and Support gets decent LMGs and can provide ammo at will(when they want to haha). Yet what does recon do well? Spawn squadmates (if a beacon is oprational), laser-designate (good one), snipe from extreme ranges (anyone they down will just get revived), bolt-action rifles (requires great skill to ensure a headshot). So overall, recon does nothing well. They have some abilities here and there but are overall useless. This is why giving recon advanced stealth would be advantageous not just to the class but the team as well. Remember though, this enhanced stealth ability would only be utilized with suppressed weapons. Any kills unsuppressed and you are spotted in the killcam. If you think this is a viable solution please reccommend it and feel free to provide any criticism. Thanks for readng and have a good one.
EDIT: 20 views and no votes? Wtf.
GT: F4ilure 117.
Unholy Leader of the Order of q.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Failure117" (Dec 2nd 2012, 6:59am)


PyaKura

Password Giver

(327)

Posts: 1,312

Date of registration
: Apr 5th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: BHIND U LOL

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 7

  • Send private message

2

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 7:53am

About the last part, I don't know why the guy simply ignored the motion sensors abilities, that's kinda stupid since it can gives you ton of points when placed near in a cluster f.

I answered "Maybe, if it was implemented right". Knowing DICE, I can hardly believe them to implement it correctly.
Ded.

Posts: 163

Date of registration
: Jun 8th 2012

Platform: PS3

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 5

  • Send private message

3

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 8:09am

Unfortunately, people will see this as an aid to camping. Also, nobody cares about recon or any other class, as long as they can spam the an94 and revive and get revived. This way everyone gets kills, but nobody dies, awesome. This game is a joke. Once the VOIP is fixed in warfighter, that will be the competitors choice.

REexpert44

Laser Eyes

(69)

Posts: 264

Date of registration
: Jun 11th 2012

Platform: PS4

Location: Detroit

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 5

  • Send private message

4

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 8:15am

From the sound sound of it this guy doesnt know a Recon can use a PDW or Shotgun. They shouldnt get any sort of advantage like that because if you can plass the class correctly there wont be an issue. If you can flank a team then you should be smart enough to tell your squadmates when to launch the attack. Plant your TUGS and beacon in a smart spot and you will have a serious advantage. If they did that then all classes should get a unique buff. (engis have better armor in vehicles, supports can resupply themselves much much faster, medics auto heal kicks in faster.)

The only thing DICE should do to help the Recon more is to give the option to spawn on either the player OR the beacon they planted and increse points for motion and spot assists. (i would say 20 for a regular spot assist and 30 for a motion sensor assist) so you would get the same points as if you helped get a suppression assist. Squad actions should also be worth 10 more points like squad spot assists and squad motion assists.
PSN:REexpert44

Failure117

cheap kitchen leeds

(76)

  • "Failure117" started this thread

Posts: 774

Date of registration
: Jun 27th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Illinois, USA

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 6

  • Send private message

5

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 8:21am

From the sound sound of it this guy doesnt know a Recon can use a PDW or Shotgun. They shouldnt get any sort of advantage like that because if you can plass the class correctly there wont be an issue. If you can flank a team then you should be smart enough to tell your squadmates when to launch the attack. Plant your TUGS and beacon in a smart spot and you will have a serious advantage. If they did that then all classes should get a unique buff. (engis have better armor in vehicles, supports can resupply themselves much much faster, medics auto heal kicks in faster.)
"My solution would be to allow recon the ability to be excepted from a player's killcam when he stabs an enemy or he shoots the enemy with a suppressed weapon. Say you are trapped in one of the situations mentioned above. Your attacking team is in a stalemate with the defenders and you know that tactic will not prove successful. Now you and your sqadmates can equip your recon classes with suppressed PDWs, DMRs (Designated Marksman Rifles - Semi-autos), or Bolt-Action Rifles and flank the enemy by surprise without them knowing your exact whereabouts, just a general area. Stealth and surveilance are key to success in Rush and I think this simple implement could change the way Rush is played for the better."


You obviously didn't read the whole thing and/or understand what he was saying.
GT: F4ilure 117.
Unholy Leader of the Order of q.

REexpert44

Laser Eyes

(69)

Posts: 264

Date of registration
: Jun 11th 2012

Platform: PS4

Location: Detroit

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 5

  • Send private message

6

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 8:32am

keep reading champ. near the bottom he lists how all the other classes are better than Recon since its abilities require "great skill". He even flat out calls them useless. He neglects semi auto rifles that are a base weapon of the class as well as PDWs at that point when factoring in the classes worth.
PSN:REexpert44

Failure117

cheap kitchen leeds

(76)

  • "Failure117" started this thread

Posts: 774

Date of registration
: Jun 27th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Illinois, USA

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 6

  • Send private message

7

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 8:50am

keep reading champ. near the bottom he lists how all the other classes are better than Recon since its abilities require "great skill". He even flat out calls them useless. He neglects semi auto rifles that are a base weapon of the class as well as PDWs at that point when factoring in the classes worth.
Semi-autos are still inferior to assault rifles and light machine guns. If one of their 'features' is being "good" against infantry (spawn beacon allows flanking, motion sensors allow better infantry tactics), then why are they so UP when compared to the other classes? None of the other classes require a great amount of skill to utilize their main weapons and Recon doesn't even have any automatic weapons that are good at medium range. Spotting can be done by every class (with a slightly greater efficiency on Recon), so that leaves spawn beacons as the only source of unique class balance that it has.


I love the Recon to death, but Support is better at providing overwatch, Engineer is better against vehicles, and Assault is better against infantry at most ranges. The only thing the Recon is good at as of now is providing long range fire (which doesn't help the team that much), providing flanking routes (which you have to flank the enemy in the first place on infantry maps), and providing a tactical advantage with motion sensors. Adding a stealth feature would give it a unique advantage against other infantry without upsetting class balance.
GT: F4ilure 117.
Unholy Leader of the Order of q.

PyaKura

Password Giver

(327)

Posts: 1,312

Date of registration
: Apr 5th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: BHIND U LOL

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 7

  • Send private message

8

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 8:58am

Semi-autos are still inferior to assault rifles and light machine guns.

How so? They have different uses, that's all. Most AR can't shoot as accurately as a semi-auto, and LMG requires to be bipoded to shoot accurately. Moreover, at close-range, one shot to the head with a semi-auto results in a OHK.
Ded.

Failure117

cheap kitchen leeds

(76)

  • "Failure117" started this thread

Posts: 774

Date of registration
: Jun 27th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Illinois, USA

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 6

  • Send private message

9

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 9:09am

Semi-autos are still inferior to assault rifles and light machine guns.

How so? They have different uses, that's all. Most AR can't shoot as accurately as a semi-auto, and LMG requires to be bipoded to shoot accurately. Moreover, at close-range, one shot to the head with a semi-auto results in a OHK.
Mostly because of suppression/saturation. They're also hard to use and require you to be pinpoint accurate.
GT: F4ilure 117.
Unholy Leader of the Order of q.

Posts: 50

Date of registration
: May 13th 2012

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 5

  • Send private message

10

Sunday, December 2nd 2012, 10:27am

Semi-auto sniper rifles are not inferior to LMG or AR, i have proven it many times and if you want i can take you 1v1 on any server. And no, im not an uber recon player, i have 30 service stars in total and recon holds only 2 with about 1000 kills from SKS.
Recon is a very popular kit on conquest hardcore, im not sure about other game mods as i only play conquest hardcore. SKS and M417 are top used weapons after that 1-shot bolt action whores... That being said, you are wrong again.

I really like your idea of stealth, and as much as id like to see any improvements to that id have to say NO to any improvements to recon class. Why ? Very simple, in right hands Recon with a sniper rifle is the deadliest kit at any range. Now when it comes to PDW's with silencers - YES, it would make sense simply because PDW's are outclassed by every weapon class in this game, so as long as recon will be limited only to PDW's i will say yes to your idea. But once you give them option of sniper rifle you will only promote uber stealth camping and give them even bigger advantage over other classes in this game.
Im only talking from my experience as i only play on conquest maps in hardcore mode, i dont know what game mods you play, so i will not judge you cause you might have a completely different experience.