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NoctyrneSAGA

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(10,148)

Posts: 7,229

Date of registration
: Apr 3rd 2012

Platform: PC

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21

Friday, February 2nd 2018, 6:12am

When you transition from hipfire to ADS while firing, your spread is clamped to ADS max if it is larger.

Making ADS max match hipfire min means you cannot just cut down a bunch of spread by ADSing.



Do you mean that if I transition from hipfire to ADS while firing, like for BAR, my ADS spread goes up to 2? That's huge, if SIPS is -0.085,

it takes 20 rounds to reset ADS spread to min base spread, is that true?



it won't go anywhere because hipfire min and ADS max match now.

Before you could start in hipfire with 2 and AS to bring it down to 1.5 or whatever the max was.
Data Browser

Passive Spotting is the future!

"Skill" may indeed be the most magical of words. Chant it well enough and any desire can be yours.

Are you a scrub?

If it flies, it dies™.

Posts: 120

Date of registration
: Nov 29th 2016

Platform: PS4

Location: Florida

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22

Friday, February 2nd 2018, 6:40am

New AimingControllers have been added specifically for the MGs.

They are 300ms and 400ms, 300 for iron sights and 400 for lenses/ scopes.

Any idea what it used to be?


It might have been nice to see the Optical LMGs treated as irons, or at least at 350.

Posts: 3,292

Date of registration
: Apr 26th 2013

Platform: PS4

Location: Arizona, USA

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23

Friday, February 2nd 2018, 9:16am

200 and 300ms.
To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question.

Nope. Aim Assist or bust; here's why:

Default Aim Assist Data

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No Auto Rotation Data

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Prepare your laughbox

the Sebstalder is quiet good since it can 3hit kill at any distanc ,but In my opinion i actually thikn the sweeper is better, its got a really really fast firerate that can beat alll those Noobmaticos, Helregall adn shitguns in close quarters , and its also really accurate out to like l;ong range,. overall great allround gun, jsut my 2$ tho


Posts: 294

Date of registration
: Jun 9th 2012

Platform: PC

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24

Saturday, February 3rd 2018, 1:16am

Hmm 400ms ADS time, this is why I am not touching scoped MGs ever again.

This is just a summary of my findings, but the result of the patch that the LMG ADS time nerf, together with non scoped SLR min spread buff, invalidated a lot of the medium range LMGs.

This is actually a huge SLR buff patch, wrapped under the name of SMG, LMG buff.

Posts: 3,292

Date of registration
: Apr 26th 2013

Platform: PS4

Location: Arizona, USA

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25

Saturday, February 3rd 2018, 5:08am

Quoted

invalidated a lot of the medium range LMGs

That's quite the statement; I don't think mid range MGs are obsolete at all as they are some of the most powerful mid range tools available now. Do you not know that bipoded MGs fire at minspread now? Or that the max BTK is 6 (with limb shots for Huot/ Lewis/ Perino)? And have you forgotten how good they are at Suppression?

It's quite silly to overlook these factors and lay out a blanket statement as you did without delving into why you think they are obsolete besides citing the ADS nerf, which only delays their reactionary shooting abilities, and buffed SLRs as your reasoning.
To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question.

Nope. Aim Assist or bust; here's why:

Default Aim Assist Data

Source code

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
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No Auto Rotation Data

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    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
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Prepare your laughbox

the Sebstalder is quiet good since it can 3hit kill at any distanc ,but In my opinion i actually thikn the sweeper is better, its got a really really fast firerate that can beat alll those Noobmaticos, Helregall adn shitguns in close quarters , and its also really accurate out to like l;ong range,. overall great allround gun, jsut my 2$ tho


Posts: 294

Date of registration
: Jun 9th 2012

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 10

  • Send private message

26

Sunday, February 4th 2018, 2:56am

Quoted

invalidated a lot of the medium range LMGs

That's quite the statement; I don't think mid range MGs are obsolete at all as they are some of the most powerful mid range tools available now. Do you not know that bipoded MGs fire at minspread now? Or that the max BTK is 6 (with limb shots for Huot/ Lewis/ Perino)? And have you forgotten how good they are at Suppression?

It's quite silly to overlook these factors and lay out a blanket statement as you did without delving into why you think they are obsolete besides citing the ADS nerf, which only delays their reactionary shooting abilities, and buffed SLRs as your reasoning.



I would take Cei Rigotti, FQ, Mondragon or even the M1916 to a midrange fight anyday over ANY of the LMGs. The fact that you need a bipod for an LMG to be effective already limited the scenarios where LMG is good.

For the sake of argument, let's say we are using the M1917 Browning LW, and make it 5BTK at all ranges. Second shot and third shot spread values are 0.774 and 0.675 respectively. At these values, we can calculate the hit rates at say 50m, but I do not have the hit rater and I can pretty safely say that they are more likely a miss than a hit. So we actually need 7 BTK, at the minimum, giving it the benefit of the doubt that bullet 4 and 5 are guaranteed hits. So TTK is minimum 800ms, before factoring in ADS time.

For this patch, even the CR gets a 3BTK at 50m. Take a look at the CR factory, which is a comparable variant to LW. Before the patch I can pretty safely say that it was spread-limited, but let's say it was recoil limited and it did not get a buff in min-deviation ROF, and it takes 28 frames i.e. 467ms to kill. Without factoring in ADS time, the number of bullets fired by the LMG is 3. Maximum suppression is 16*3=48 I believe? If all the bullets connected with the head, which is statistically very improbable. Even if that happens, suppression does not kick in until 54ish.

Let's give the LMG some slack and consider the M1916 factory. The M1916 does not seem to benefit a lot from the patch but because of the low ROF, it is very prone to spam-fire and the SIPS reduction is making it very forgiving in terms of its spam-fireability. Lower min spread also helps as well, because players can go for the head at longer ranges without the need for optical/marksman/sniper variants. Using the same calculations from above, the M1916 has 567ms TTK and it is easier to achieve that the CR's 467. Maximum suppression is 64 and this is pretty much impossible to achieve due to 2nd and 3rd bullets having a large deviation. Pretty much the time when you start to suppress the medics is the time when he fired his bullet to kill you.

The analysis for M1916 factory applies also to pre-patch, but the purpose here is to show that other than the SLR that has a high Hrec, very slow fire rate, postpatch we have other faster firing, lower Hrec SLRs that can do the job more effectively.

I haven't even started on why they have to increase the Hrec on the Lewis, Huot and Perino. The Lewis LW right now has too much Hrec to compete in the medium range space, IMO of course.

I purposefully did not factor in ADS time in the calculation because LMG is supposed to be proactive weapons and I understand that, so I assume both parties are ADS'd at the time of firing.

Posts: 312

Date of registration
: Jun 21st 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Moscow, Russia

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27

Sunday, February 4th 2018, 6:53am

I would take Cei Rigotti, FQ, Mondragon or even the M1916 to a midrange fight anyday over ANY of the LMGs.
Grab a "pin down" perk and goold luck for any medic to outshoot you at mid-range in a pure duel. SLRs still heavily suffer from suppression and heavily punish you for misses in many cases. Even if you manage to suppress a support palyer - he can still shoot at you and have more bullets. I'd say that "medic vs support" duel at mid-range now is a "quality vs quantity" but equal in general.
Sorry for my bad english - it's not my native language and I have difficulties with acquiring speaking/writing practice in my country. If I accidently insult you or say something wrong - I'm sorry, you can feel free to correct me.

Posts: 181

Date of registration
: Dec 14th 2016

Platform: PS4

Location: UK

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28

Sunday, February 4th 2018, 10:13am

I'm with sid_tai on this one.

LMGs now need to go through two significant spells of inaccuracy before their damage can start to materialise. To really say that medic vs support is now equal in general at mid-range is not even close to the truth.

I've not tried the CR, but the FQ Storm, Mondragon Storm and AL8 . 25 Extended (weapons with low recoil that were previously spread limited) are now truly devastating against pretty much anything.

Posts: 294

Date of registration
: Jun 9th 2012

Platform: PC

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29

Sunday, February 4th 2018, 11:59am

Quoted

I'm with sid_tai on this one.

LMGs now need to go through two significant spells of inaccuracy before their damage can start to materialise. To really say that medic vs support is now equal in general at mid-range is not even close to the truth.

I've not tried the CR, but the FQ Storm, Mondragon Storm and AL8 . 25 Extended (weapons with low recoil that were previously spread limited) are now truly devastating against pretty much anything.
Yep, previously spread limited SLRs is de wae right now.

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: May 8th 2015

Platform: PS4

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30

Sunday, February 4th 2018, 6:01pm

I've noticed a few things:


  • Sjögren has now 12 pellets, symthic stats still show 13 pellets
  • Storm should be added to Maschinenpistole M1912 in the sym weapon charts
  • Infantry should be added to Type 38 Arisaka in the sym weapon charts
  • Carbine should be added to Carcano M91 in the sym weapon charts
  • C93 Carbine is missing from Misc category