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11

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 1:36am

2 possibilities:

1. To emphasize their, overall, poor close range performances.

2. The first step in DICE gunplay dev's weapon rebalancing.

Quoted from "DICE-RandomDeviation"

I'm actually working on a pretty significant weapon rebalance right now to try to get some more variation between existing weapons, and to get myself some more design space for future ones.

The nerf to MG hipfire seems to be a possible tradeoff for better performance at mid range. I guess we'll see.


Oh holy crap I completely missed that post! Reading that makes me so happy in so many ways, the hype train is locked and loaded!
Who has fun, wins.

VincentNZ

Holy War? No Thanks.

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12

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 10:31am

This is nice and all, but I do not see the bigger picture here. The intention is to give them some design space for new weapons; at the moment this seems to be a hip-fire friendly LMG. But I do not see how you make this with nerfing every other LMG and add one that is rather good at it, or as "good" as LMGs were a couple of months ago. What matters the most in hipfire engagements is your reaction time and the ability to hit the first bullets faster. If you want a real hipfire LMG you are better off getting rid of the negative spread mechanic in my book.
In general I do not see why a hipfire nerf for LMGs was in order with the amount of CQ fights you have, but I guess it is to differntiate the automatic weapon's niche even further?

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13

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 11:20am

Might be to prevent future power creep or something.

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14

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 12:28pm

2 possibilities:

1. To emphasize their, overall, poor close range performances.

2. I'm actually working on a pretty significant weapon rebalance right now to try to get some more variation between existing weapons, and to get myself some more design space for future ones.

The nerf to MG hipfire seems to be a possible tradeoff for better performance at mid range. I guess we'll see.
Perhaps it will be repeat of the RPK 74m to RPK 12 rebalance in which the RPK was given a new projectile and a unique damage model amongts the LMG's whilst the RPK 12 got further buffs to its ADS spread. (Don't remember the details)

https://twitter.com/DanMinigun/status/902552308537548800

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15

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 12:53pm

So this theory for the Perino v Huot, where the Perino's damage remains the same and accuracy increased, and the Huot gets a bump in max or min or both max/ min damage in exchange for less accuracy. That seems plausible.

If that's the case then expect:

Flip flop min spread - 0.21 for Huot, 0.18 for Perino
Boost max or min or both max/ min damage - 27-15, 23-17.5, 27-17.5 for Huot (as you covered)
To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question.

Nope. Aim Assist or bust; here's why:

Default Aim Assist Data

Source code

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.75
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 1.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.34
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.2
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 1.2
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0

No Slowdown Data

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.0
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 1.0
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom -1.0
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.0
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 0.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.0
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.0
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
    DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0


No Auto Rotation Data

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 AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.75
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 1.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.34
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.0
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
    DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0

Prepare your laughbox

the Sebstalder is quiet good since it can 3hit kill at any distanc ,but In my opinion i actually thikn the sweeper is better, its got a really really fast firerate that can beat alll those Noobmaticos, Helregall adn shitguns in close quarters , and its also really accurate out to like l;ong range,. overall great allround gun, jsut my 2$ tho


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16

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 3:02pm

So this theory for the Perino v Huot, where the Perino's damage remains the same and accuracy increased, and the Huot gets a bump in max or min or both max/ min damage in exchange for less accuracy. That seems plausible.

If that's the case then expect:

Flip flop min spread - 0.21 for Huot, 0.18 for Perino
Boost max or min or both max/ min damage - 27-15, 23-17.5, 27-17.5 for Huot (as you covered)

Yes. I am assuming that ADS moving would be improved, perhaps on par with the BAR (0.5). That would make the Huot Optical the best moving ADS out of all LMGS (0.375). Horizontal recoil would likely go up as well so to the Perino becomes the new Huot. I am heavily basing the theoretical new huot on the transition from the RPK to RPK 74, in which it has a unique damage model among st the LMGS in BF4.

The primary reasons for this is the fact that the RPK-74 was more accurate than the RPK-12 but was too small of a difference, to the point that the 61 round mag (W Faster reload) was generally more viable. This seems very close to the current situation between the Lewis/Huot/Perino. I can appreciate the huot's 0.18 ADS w 0.605 2nd shot -> 0.18ADS 5th bullet, but I think it is too minor to be appreciated by most [even experienced] players. (further confirmed by RandomDeviation's comment)

Removing the excessive bounce on Huot Optical would further enhance that variant's viability.

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17

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 3:08pm

But the Huot uses the .303 British. They'd have to buff the Lewis gun too, DICE has been pretty consistent about having the same muzzle velocity and damage within a weapon class using the same projectile.

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18

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 3:32pm

I thought of that too, and that's fine, I'd expect a buff to the Lewis anyway.
Who has fun, wins.

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19

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 3:43pm

So this theory for the Perino v Huot, where the Perino's damage remains the same and accuracy increased, and the Huot gets a bump in max or min or both max/ min damage in exchange for less accuracy. That seems plausible.

If that's the case then expect:

Flip flop min spread - 0.21 for Huot, 0.18 for Perino
Boost max or min or both max/ min damage - 27-15, 23-17.5, 27-17.5 for Huot (as you covered)
They would give it a new projectile as they did to the RPK 74 (Renamed RPK to reflect its shift from 5.45x39 to 7.62.39). The projectile in question would be '762x39mmWP_Heavy', which was created solely as a means to balance out the 'new' RPK 74. No other gun uses this projectile.

Snapshot of RPK-74 Projectile change from symthic style patch notes.


A 303_Huot wouldn't be too difficult imagine

Link to BF 4 May 2015 Patch notes

26th May 2015 Battlefield 4 Patch notes - Symthic style?
But the Huot uses the .303 British. They'd have to buff the Lewis gun too, DICE has been pretty consistent about having the same muzzle velocity and damage within a weapon class using the same projectile.

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20

Wednesday, August 30th 2017, 9:21pm

The RPK got a new round because it fires a different round, one that no other gun used. The Huot does not. Not a valid comparison.

The Lewis needs very similar buffs to the Huot anyway, there's a 0% chance that they won't both be buffed together.
Who has fun, wins.