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C0llis

Up and down. Bounce all around

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: Apr 15th 2013

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21

Tuesday, March 21st 2017, 2:25pm

I assume this doesn't include planes..

I believe it does, but I am not exactly sure if it includes vehicle-on-vehicle kills. I should have plotted with longer x-axis to see how far things extend, but already closed my notebooks ^^
If it does include planes, do you know how distance for kills by bombs are measured? If the distance between bomb and player is counted - instead of the distance between player and plane - that could explain the spike at <5(?) meters. That spike goes counter to what I would expect from my experience in game.

Including bomb/dart kills at all would probably do weird things to the stats, no matter how the distance is measured, as the plane is never in the same place when the bombs go off as it was when it dropped the bombs.

Things people said

And reading Youtube comments still gives me Turbo Cancer.

It really is quite frustrating when Helen Keller sets up her LMG in the only doorway in/out of an area.

What kind of question is that? Since when is cheese ever a bad idea?

Hardline is a fun and sometimes silly Cops and Robbers sorta thing and I think that's great. Or it would be if it didn't suck.

Miffyli

Symthic Developer

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: Mar 21st 2013

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22

Tuesday, March 21st 2017, 3:35pm

If it does include planes, do you know how distance for kills by bombs are measured? If the distance between bomb and player is counted - instead of the distance between player and plane - that could explain the spike at <5(?) meters. That spike goes counter to what I would expect from my experience in game.

Including bomb/dart kills at all would probably do weird things to the stats, no matter how the distance is measured, as the plane is never in the same place when the bombs go off as it was when it dropped the bombs.

The kill distance is distance between killer (who gets +1 kill) and target (+1 death) at the moment of target dying, so in case of "delayed weapons" like bombs it can be somewhat off.

Seems like horse is the culprit of such high density at the lower end (surprisingly many of the kills seem to be with horse melee):

Source code

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                  Weapon   Mean   Med  75th  90th    Num  Rel
            vehicles.A7V:  44.6  34.5  58.6  87.8   1402 18.4
        vehicles.Renault:  45.8  33.2  61.6  99.3    925 12.2
    vehicles.Halberstadt:  58.9  40.7  91.7 149.0    757  9.9
          vehicles.MarkV:  48.7  33.4  63.7 111.9    659  8.7
       vehicles.FokkerDr:  44.0  33.4  48.7  95.1    658  8.6
          vehicles.Horse:   8.8   5.9   9.3  14.0    493  6.5
       vehicles.GothaGIV:  74.5  60.0 110.3 180.0    486  6.4
     vehicles.stationary: 113.3  87.8 166.8 232.3    408  5.4
    vehicles.PierceArrow:  88.3  64.5 130.4 183.9    316  4.2
         vehicles.mortar:  63.6  63.9  78.4  90.8    278  3.7
       vehicles.Zeppelin: 124.0 117.2 142.7 171.0    253  3.3
   vehicles.ArmoredTrain:  80.7  68.1 128.0 176.5    233  3.1
          vehicles.7n7cm:  85.8  68.0 118.6 162.0    197  2.6
     vehicles.RollsRoyse:  27.3  20.4  34.8  58.3    152  2.0
 vehicles.FortressTurret: 187.0 152.2 286.7 322.8    143  1.9
    vehicles.Dreadnought: 402.4 392.0 559.3 692.6    120  1.6
      vehicles.MotorBoat:  54.9  36.7  82.4 121.0     81  1.1
     vehicles.DodgeScout:  32.9  14.1  34.3  77.9     40  0.5
      vehicles.HDSidecar:   4.5   4.2   6.3   8.6     12  0.2
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

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: Jan 12th 2014

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23

Tuesday, March 21st 2017, 9:45pm

If it does include planes, do you know how distance for kills by bombs are measured? If the distance between bomb and player is counted - instead of the distance between player and plane - that could explain the spike at <5(?) meters. That spike goes counter to what I would expect from my experience in game.

Including bomb/dart kills at all would probably do weird things to the stats, no matter how the distance is measured, as the plane is never in the same place when the bombs go off as it was when it dropped the bombs.

The kill distance is distance between killer (who gets +1 kill) and target (+1 death) at the moment of target dying, so in case of "delayed weapons" like bombs it can be somewhat off.

Seems like horse is the culprit of such high density at the lower end (surprisingly many of the kills seem to be with horse melee):

Source code

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                  Weapon   Mean   Med  75th  90th    Num  Rel
            vehicles.A7V:  44.6  34.5  58.6  87.8   1402 18.4
        vehicles.Renault:  45.8  33.2  61.6  99.3    925 12.2
    vehicles.Halberstadt:  58.9  40.7  91.7 149.0    757  9.9
          vehicles.MarkV:  48.7  33.4  63.7 111.9    659  8.7
       vehicles.FokkerDr:  44.0  33.4  48.7  95.1    658  8.6
          vehicles.Horse:   8.8   5.9   9.3  14.0    493  6.5
       vehicles.GothaGIV:  74.5  60.0 110.3 180.0    486  6.4
     vehicles.stationary: 113.3  87.8 166.8 232.3    408  5.4
    vehicles.PierceArrow:  88.3  64.5 130.4 183.9    316  4.2
         vehicles.mortar:  63.6  63.9  78.4  90.8    278  3.7
       vehicles.Zeppelin: 124.0 117.2 142.7 171.0    253  3.3
   vehicles.ArmoredTrain:  80.7  68.1 128.0 176.5    233  3.1
          vehicles.7n7cm:  85.8  68.0 118.6 162.0    197  2.6
     vehicles.RollsRoyse:  27.3  20.4  34.8  58.3    152  2.0
 vehicles.FortressTurret: 187.0 152.2 286.7 322.8    143  1.9
    vehicles.Dreadnought: 402.4 392.0 559.3 692.6    120  1.6
      vehicles.MotorBoat:  54.9  36.7  82.4 121.0     81  1.1
     vehicles.DodgeScout:  32.9  14.1  34.3  77.9     40  0.5
      vehicles.HDSidecar:   4.5   4.2   6.3   8.6     12  0.2
And it looks like dread shelling is responsible for the really long tail. It's getting meaningful numbers of its kills out past 500m.

Even with the bias of the horse, the aggregate bias moved the mean/media for tanks outwards. Those individual stats for the A7 and MarkIV show that the "typical" kill is at about 35, which is practically within AT gren range if the opposition reaches a bit.

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24

Wednesday, May 10th 2017, 1:44am

Any ETA on when we might see this by class?

I would venture to guess on the maps where the kill density ranges trend farther are almost entirely skewed by scouts. FAO fortress is a notorious sniping-fest.

Miffyli

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25

Wednesday, May 10th 2017, 11:56am

Any ETA on when we might see this by class?

I would venture to guess on the maps where the kill density ranges trend farther are almost entirely skewed by scouts. FAO fortress is a notorious sniping-fest.

To be honest I have not touched this since I published these results, still blaming my studies and whatnot :(

But if somebody can provide me weapon->class table it should be just matter of plugging it in.
Here's a table with weapon names and classes (by default -1). If somebody can update the numbers to represent the correct class I could plot per-class results.

0 = Gadget, melee or other "non weapons".
1 = Assault
2 = Medic
3 = Support
4 = Recon
5 = Pickup weapons
6 = Sidearm

Spoiler Spoiler

Source code

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{'U_ATGrenade': -1,
 'U_BARM1918': -1,
 'U_BerettaM1915': -1,
 'U_BerettaM1918': -1,
 'U_Bergmann1915MG': -1,
 'U_Bodeo1889': -1,
 'U_BorchardtC93': -1,
 'U_BreechGun': -1,
 'U_BrowningA5': -1,
 'U_Bulldog': -1,
 'U_CeiRigottiM1895': -1,
 'U_Crossbow': -1,
 'U_FN1903': -1,
 'U_FrommerStop': -1,
 'U_FrommerStopAuto': -1,
 'U_GasserM1870': -1,
 'U_Gewehr98': -1,
 'U_Grenade': -1,
 'U_Hammerless': -1,
 'U_Hellriegel1915': -1,
 'U_HotchkissM1909': -1,
 'U_HuotAutoRifle': -1,
 'U_LancasterHowdah': -1,
 'U_LeeEnfieldSMLE': -1,
 'U_LewisMG': -1,
 'U_Luger1906': -1,
 'U_LugerArtillery': -1,
 'U_LugerP08': -1,
 'U_M1911': -1,
 'U_MP18': -1,
 'U_MadsenMG': -1,
 'U_MarsAutoPistol': -1,
 'U_MartiniHenry': -1,
 'U_Mauser1914': -1,
 'U_MauserC96': -1,
 'U_MauserC96AutoPistol': -1,
 'U_MauserSL1916': -1,
 'U_MaximMG0815': -1,
 'U_Mondragon': -1,
 'U_PieperCarbine': -1,
 'U_RemingtonM10': -1,
 'U_RemingtonModel8': -1,
 'U_SawnOffShotgun': -1,
 'U_SmithWesson': -1,
 'U_SpringfieldM1903': -1,
 'U_SteyrM1912': -1,
 'U_SteyrManM1895': -1,
 'U_TankGewehr': -1,
 'U_TripWireBomb': -1,
 'U_TripWireBurn': -1,
 'U_VillarPerosa': -1,
 'U_WebFosAutoRev': -1,
 'U_Winchester1897': -1,
 'U_WinchesterM1895': -1,
 'U_WinchesterM1907': -1
}


Here's the table used to turn weapon names from filenames to "proper" names, should help you out:

Spoiler Spoiler

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    "BARM1918_Customization_Bipod": "BAR_1918_Telescopic",
    "BARM1918_Customization_Stability": "BAR_1918_Storm",
    "BARM1918_Customization_Trench": "BAR_1918_Trench",
    "BerettaM1915_Customization": "Beretta_M1915",
    "BerettaM1918_Customization": "Automatico_M1918_Factory",
    "BerettaM1918_Customization_Stability": "Automatico_M1918_Storm",
    "BerettaM1918_Customization_Trench": "Automatico_M1918_Trench",
    "Bergmann1915MG_Customization": "MG15_N.A._Low_Weight",
    "Bergmann1915MG_Customization_Stability": "MG15_N.A._Storm",
    "Bergmann1915MG_Customization_Suppression": "MG15_N.A._Suppressive",
    "Bodeo1889_Customization": "Bodeo_1889",
    "BorchardtC93_Customization": "Borchard_C93",
    
    "BrowningA5_Customization_Choke": "12g_Automatic_Hunter",
    "BrowningA5_Customization_ExtensionTube": "12g_Automatic_Extended",
    "BrowningA5_Customization_LowRecoil": "12g_Automatic_Backbored",
    
    "Bulldog_Customization": "Bulldog",
    
    "Chauchat_Customization": "Chauchat_Low_Weight",
    "Chauchat_Customization_Bipod": "Chauchat_Telescopic",
    
    "CeiRigottiM1895_Customization": "Cei-Rigotti_Factory",
    "CeiRigottiM1895_Customization_Range": "Cei-Rigotti_Optical",
    "CeiRigottiM1895_Customization_Trench": "Cei-Rigotti_Trench",
    "FN1903_Customization": "Mle_M1903",
    "FrommerStop_Customization": "Frommer_Stop",
    "FrommerStopAuto": "Frommer_Stop_Auto",
    "GasserM1870_Customization": "Gasser_M1870",
    "Gewehr98_Customization": "Gewehr_98_Infantry",
    "Gewehr98_Customization_LongRange": "Gewehr_98_Sniper",
    "Gewehr98_Customization_Scope": "Gewehr_98_Marksman",
    "Hammerless_Customization": "1903_Hammerless",
    "Hellriegel1915_Customization": "Hellriegel_1915_Factory",
    "Hellriegel1915_Customization_Accuracy": "Hellriegel_1915_Defensive",
    "HotchkissM1909_Customization_Bipod": "M1909_Benet-Mercie_Telescopic",
    "HotchkissM1909_Customization_Range": "M1909_Benet-Mercie_Optical",
    "HotchkissM1909_Customization_Stability": "M1909_Benet-Mercie_Storm",
    "HuotAutoRifle_Customization": "Huot_Automatic_Low_Weight",
    "HuotAutoRifle_Customization_Range": "Huot_Automatic_Optical",
    "LancasterHowdah_Customization": "Howdah_Pistol",
    
    "Lebel1886_Customization": "Lebel_Model_1886_Infantry",
    "Lebel1886_Customization_LongRange": "Lebel_Model_1886_Sniper",
    
    "LeeEnfieldSMLE_Customization": "SMLE_MKIII_Infantry",
    "LeeEnfieldSMLE_Customization_Med": "SMLE_MKIII_Carbine",
    "LeeEnfieldSMLE_Customization_Scope": "SMLE_MKIII_Marksman",
    "LewisMG_Customization": "Lewis_Gun_Low_Weight",
    "LewisMG_Customization_Range": "Lewis_Gun_Optical",
    "LewisMG_Customization_Suppression": "Lewis_Gun_Suppressive",
    "Luger1906_Customization": "Selbstlader_1906_Factory",
    "Luger1906_Customization_Scope": "Selbstlader_1906_Sniper",
    "LugerArtillery_Customization": "P08_Artillery",
    "LugerP08_Customization": "P08_Pistol",
    "M1911_Customization": "M1911",
    "M1911_Stock": "M1911_Extended",
    "MP18_Customization_Accuracy": "MP_18_Optical",
    "MP18_Customization_Burst": "MP_18_Experimental",
    "MP18_Customization_Trench": "MP_18_Trench",
    "MadsenMG_Customization": "Madsen_MG_Low_Weight",
    "MadsenMG_Customization_Stability": "Madsen_MG_Storm",
    "MadsenMG_Customization_Trench": "Madsen_MG_Trench",
    "MarsAutoPistol_Customization": "Mars_Automatic_Pistol",
    "MartiniHenry_Customization": "Martini-Henry_Infantry",
    "MartiniHenry_Customization_LongRange": "Martini-Henry_Sniper",
    "Mauser1914_Customization": "Taschenpistole_M1914",
    "MauserC96AutoPistol_Customization": "C96_Carbine",
    "MauserC96_Customization": "Mauser_C96",
    "MauserSL1916_Customization": "Selbstlader_M1916_Factory",
    "MauserSL1916_Customization_Range": "Selbstlader_M1916_Optical",
    "MauserSL1916_Customization_Scope": "Selbstlader_M1916_Marksman",
    
    "Mondragon_Customization_Bipod": "Mondragon_Sniper",
    "Mondragon_Customization_Range": "Mondragon_Optical",
    "Mondragon_Customization_Stability": "Mondragon_Storm",
    "PieperCarbine_Customization": "Pieper_M1893",
    
    "RSC1917_Customization": "RSC_1917_Factory",
    "RSC1917_Customization_Range": "RSC_1917_Optical",
    
    "TankGewehr_Customization": "Tankgewehr_M1918",
    "VillarPerosa_Customization": "Villar_Perosa",
    "MaximMG0815_Customization": "MG_08-15",
    
    "Ribeyrolles_Customization": "Ribeyrolles_1918_Factory",
    
    "FN1903stock_Customization": "FN1903_Extended",
    
    "RemingtonM10_Customization": "Model_10-A_Factory",
    "RemingtonM10_Customization_Choke": "Model_10-A_Hunter",
    "RemingtonM10_Customization_Slug": "Model_10-A_Slug",
    
    "RemingtonModel8_Customization": "Autoloading_8_.35_Factory",
    "RemingtonModel8_Customization_ExtendedMag": "Autoloading_8_.25_Extended",
    "RemingtonModel8_Customization_Scope": "Autoloading_8_.35_Marksman",
    
    "SawnOffShotgun": "Sawed_Off_Shotgun",
    
    "SjogrenShotgun_Customization": "Sjögren_Inertial_Factory",
    
    "SmithWesson_Customization": "No._3_Revolver",
    "SpringfieldM1903_Customization_LongRange": "M1903_Sniper",
    "SpringfieldM1903_Customization_Pedersen": "M1903_Experimental",
    "SpringfieldM1903_Customization_Scope": "M1903_Marksman",
    "SteyrM1912_Customization": "Steyr_M1912",
    "SteyrManM1895_Customization": "Gewehr_M.95_Infantry",
    "SteyrManM1895_Customization_Med": "Gewehr_M.95_Carbine",
    "SteyrManM1895_Customization_Scope": "Gewehr_M.95_Marksman",
    
    "WebFosAutoRev_Customization_455Webley": "Auto_revolver",
    
    "Winchester1897_Customization_Choke": "M97_Trench_Gun_Hunter",
    "Winchester1897_Customization_LowRecoil": "M97_Trench_Gun_Backbored",
    "Winchester1897_Customization_Sweeper": "M97_Trench_Gun_Sweeper",
    
    "WinchesterM1895_Customization": "Russian_1895_Infantry",
    "WinchesterM1895_Customization_Horse": "Russian_1895_Cavalry",
    "WinchesterM1895_Customization_Long": "Russian_1895_Sniper",
    "WinchesterM1895_Customization_Trench": "Russian_1895_Trench",
    "WinchesterM1907_Customization": "M1907_SL_Factory",
    "WinchesterM1907_Customization_Auto": "M1907_SL_Sweeper",
    "WinchesterM1907_Customization_Trench": "M1907_SL_Trench",
}
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

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Date of registration
: Dec 26th 2015

Platform: PC

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26

Friday, May 19th 2017, 3:56am


Quoted from "OldBFAddict"
Any ETA on when we might see this by class?

I would venture to guess on the maps where the kill density ranges trend farther are almost entirely skewed by scouts. FAO fortress is a notorious sniping-fest.
To be honest I have not touched this since I published these results, still blaming my studies and whatnot :(
But if somebody can provide me weapon->class table it should be just matter of plugging it in.
Here's a table with weapon names and classes (by default -1). If somebody can update the numbers to represent the correct class I could plot per-class results.
0 = Gadget, melee or other "non weapons".
1 = Assault
2 = Medic
3 = Support
4 = Recon
5 = Pickup weapons
6 = Sidearm


I'm going to attempt to work on this after I get out of work tonight - but I've got a question, tanker/pilot weapons are in the list as well.
EDIT: I assumed #7 would be pilot/tanker class
I also hope that a text file will work since I seem to fail at getting spoilers to work properly.

EDIT AGAIN: Class specific sidearms are classified just as sidearms, right? I hope so, cause that's how I did it. :D
lope_a_dope has attached the following file:
I love the math behind the statistics
It's possible to find me online at almost any given time, due to the fact that my schedule is hectic and rather non-existent.

Who needs sleep anyways?
(PC/PS4 gamer)

Various bf4 spreadsheets: (nothing special, just raw data from the Symthic website put into a spreadsheet to analyze all values at once)

Spoiler Spoiler


General Weapon spreadsheet:
BF4_Weapons_enhanced_UPDATED_2016
Soldier Equipment:
BF4_Gadget_Damage
Interactive Damage Table
bf4_dmg_at_range - Google Sheets
Unsuppressed Sniper Rifle Bullet Drop Charts
bf4_sniper_guide
Suppressed Sniper Rifle Bullet Drop Charts
Suppressed bf4_sniper_guide
More user friendly Unsuppressed Sniper Rifle Bullet Drop Chart
Friendlier Sniper rifle Bullet Drop Chart
More user friendly Suppressed Sniper Rifle Bullet Drop Chart
Friendlier Suppressed Sniper Rifle Bullet Drop Chart

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "lope_a_dope" (May 19th 2017, 6:15am)


Sheepnub

I pity the wool

(2,328)

Posts: 3,229

Date of registration
: Sep 20th 2013

Platform: PC

Location: Atlantis

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27

Friday, May 19th 2017, 9:20am

Surprised. Would have expected shorter killdistances after the current 3-fold habbit of nerfing inf weapons every next release.


Eh
"I put aside a few sceptics, the types of decency in the history of philosophy: the rest haven't the slightest conception of intellectual integrity."
Friedrich Nietzsche


Best of epic quotes :D

Spoiler Spoiler

Just realized it's 4/20 tomorrow


Thanks for the heads up!
*Logs out of Symthic in preparation*

Hardline is a fun and sometimes silly Cops and Robbers sorta thing and I think that's great. Or it would be if it didn't suck.

>littlebird passanger, semi-auto frag rounds
>gunship OP

Meanwhile at DICE-headquarters during BF4's release:

I'm pretty sure there's a massive post-it on every desk "DON'T FUCKING TOUCH ANYTHING THAT IS ACTUALLY DOING WHAT IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE DOING"

UCAV:
"Hey guys remember how stupid prenerf mav was?"

"Lets add c4 to it."

The World Champion went to China once.

They called me a Gweilo.

So I kicked a big fucking hole in their wall and let all the Mongolians in.

just thought I'd share.


The thought of Assaults running out of ACE 23 rounds mid firefight, Engineers facing the rear of an unaware MBT with no rockets left, Recons unable to...Whatever the fuck they do. These are the things that keep me up at night ;(


About hunturk:
I don't know what's funnier, the video itself of the fact that an unlisted video has more views than most of your normal videos :P

...


You just live to hit people upside the noggin with a Math Bomb, don't you?

[context] Maybe it's the UK's overly aggressive porn filter at work. After all, it does have the word "monkey" in it and monkeys have been known to have sex so...


Previously, at DICE HQ:
"Ok guys, the password is "epic dream worlds"; everyone take a letter and do your best to turn it into into something random that we can put into a picture!"


I assume a functional game (BF4) also.

Aww!
*pinches cheeks*
So cute!


But but but

He's a Youtuber ;(

There's no way he doesn't know what he's talking about


VincentNZ

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28

Friday, May 19th 2017, 11:25am

Yeah that is mostly due to the amount of vehicle kills which are more long ranged and more common, as well as vehicle deaths which are often multi-kills. Also I am pretty sure that the buffed BAs extend the range a bit. That is if you include all kills. Still wonder if assists are counted, because this would likely increase the range as well. For me, I think a third could be assist count as kill with BAs.

In the end BF4 still favoured close range kills but offered a more balanced chart over the distances.

Miffyli

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Friday, May 19th 2017, 4:50pm

@lope_a_dope
Thanks! I just happen to be on a laptop for few days so can't do it quite yet, but I try to remember to do this when I get back to my main setup.
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

Miffyli

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30

Wednesday, June 7th 2017, 7:06pm

I have updated the main post with quick per-class analysis of kill distances (finally... I am terrible at time managing nowadays).
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included