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NoctyrneSAGA

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11

Tuesday, March 14th 2017, 11:12pm

Except that is exactly what made MANPADs and vehicle SAMs so dangerous to helicopters on top of killing them in 3 rockets


People were furious about being pushed into objects so it was changed to only loss of engine power.

If a helicopter is at 70% but got flipped over, why not just make it do 100% damage and not put them through the frustration of what is effectively an instant death anyways?

We've already discussed this before: raw damage is never going to deter pilots unless it's an exorbitant amount of damage.


Because the threat of destruction is obviously not a deterrent!

It's simply irrational to compare burst healing to sustained healing, because they are both different. You even point this out yourself


Trying to show the terrible heal/sec of a burst heal completely downplays its ability, and why it was so vehemently complained about. A 10% burst heal is much, much less stronger than 20-30%, and still much more stronger than a friendly wrenching a tank for 2 seconds


No. I did not say it is irrational to compare the two. Where do I say that? All I said is that the two are different which is good.

We don't need two of the exact same form of healing.



People complained that self-heal made Repair Tools irrelevant.

I pointed out what Repair Tools contributed in comparison to Emergency Repair and the self repair, quite clearly showing that Repair Tools have a place in vehicle healing.

That is why the comparison is made.



Furthermore, yes, 10% burst heal is going to do better than wrenching for 2 seconds.

That is specifically the scenario where it is going to be better.

Compare the full cooldown of 30s versus how much the repair tool provides in that time and suddenly it is no contest.

Repair Tool is best long term healing. It's not designed to do the same thing as a burst heal like Emergency Repair.
Data Browser

Passive Spotting is the future!

With this, I'll rid MGO3 of infestation. Sans bad gameplay MGO3 will be torn asunder. And then it shall be free. People will suffer, of course - a phantom pain.

Reddit and Konami will rewrite the records... And I will be demonized in human memory. But... The thirst for good gameplay that I have planted will infest MGO3. No one can stop it now. The Rebalance Mod will unleash that thirst unto the future.


Are you a scrub?

If it flies, it dies™.

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12

Tuesday, March 14th 2017, 11:27pm

Could someone check if there was a change to body part damage multipliers for the m.95 and the russian 1895 trench?

It felt like I got a few low dmg hits, but I was not able to reliably reproduce them so it might have just been confusion on my part or a heal tick for the enemy that I missed (it was a few combos where the pistol hit did not kill the opponent that got me thinking). If the rifles are the same there is of course the possibilty that the pistols got a changed multiplier for legs or lower body/arm hits, but I think that would have been in the patch notes.

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13

Wednesday, March 15th 2017, 12:06am

I'm intrigued at the rationale behind the impact damage reduction to the AA. I personally believe the reduction of rotation was a good decision since it alleviates the frustration involved with being forced off-course or into the ground.

Curious about the AA impact damage, however. So DICE determined that the direct damage by an AA shell was too important in securing a kill with the turret, and that the main source of damage should be coming from the explosion and splash of the shell itself? I'd appreciate it if someone can verify.

NoctyrneSAGA

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14

Wednesday, March 15th 2017, 12:19am

So DICE determined that the direct damage by an AA shell was too important in securing a kill with the turret, and that the main source of damage should be coming from the explosion and splash of the shell itself? I'd appreciate it if someone can verify.


The opposite.

Most of the damage came from the blast.

Impact only came from when the plane was flying straight into the AA gun and when that happened, suddenly the airplane took a lot more damage than normal.

While there is still extra damage from impact, the reduction makes damage from AA more consistent.
Data Browser

Passive Spotting is the future!

With this, I'll rid MGO3 of infestation. Sans bad gameplay MGO3 will be torn asunder. And then it shall be free. People will suffer, of course - a phantom pain.

Reddit and Konami will rewrite the records... And I will be demonized in human memory. But... The thirst for good gameplay that I have planted will infest MGO3. No one can stop it now. The Rebalance Mod will unleash that thirst unto the future.


Are you a scrub?

If it flies, it dies™.

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15

Wednesday, March 15th 2017, 12:27am

Quoted

People were furious about being pushed into objects so it was changed to only loss of engine power.



Which is still a significant impact to vehicle control and maneuverability. Who honestly lost total control from being shot at by stationary AAs pre-patch? Only pilots who flew close to the ground/nearby tall props and were baited by AAs and caught with their pants down. A pretty intelligent way to use something that deterred and occasionally killed pilots. This strat's impact is greatly diminished post-TSNP, and even firing upon planes at max range can put you at risk of being killed by pilots, thanks to no impulse shaking.

Again, what is the point of this AA nerf? It's a straight up buff to poor pilots and further encouragement for pro flyboys to continue farming infantry with no retaliation, sans another pilot or a tank who lands a lucky shell.

Where are the buffs to anti-plane capabilities of infantry? Or do we have to wait another 1-2 months for DICE to maybe throw them a bone?

Quoted

Because the threat of destruction is obviously not a deterrent!



In an average pub server, there is practically no threat of destruction to a Trench Fighter or Ground Support Attack plane from AA (or was pre-TSNP, if the pilot was actually intelligent).


Infantry small arms? Please, I've had entire squads open fire with their Lewis Suppressives and bolt-actions, and a plane flying away with 40-60 damage taken is simply going to erase all their work in 2-3 repair cycles and come back. A pilot is always going to trade a good portion of HP for some kills if the HP loss doesn't actually result in a serious chance of vehicle destruction or death.


Me and some other posters here have argued that infantry should have a much greater impact at disrupting a plane's ability to operate through easier part destructions and added impulse shaking, but other people have been strongly resistant to the idea and think the status quo is fine now. Any vehicle that can target infantry with ease should be proportionally vulnerable to retaliation by infantry, but this is simply not the case right now for planes.

Quoted

No. I did not say it is irrational to compare the two.

I don't think I've spoken well enough. Emergency Repair was easily abused despite its long cooldown, precisely because it was too powerful at what it did. 30%, hell even 20% is a massive burst heal, completely negating 1-2 AT rockets or grenade.


A Support repairbro is always going to be useful, but the tools available for tank drivers now make him less valued. But thanks to the Emergency Repair nerf, Wrench Supports are definitely going to needed much more now, which is a very good thing.

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16

Wednesday, March 15th 2017, 12:43am

Wait could people back up for a second? Were there changes to armor that I didn't see in the patch notes? Did emergency repair get nerfed or something?

NoctyrneSAGA

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17

Wednesday, March 15th 2017, 12:48am

Again, what is the point of this AA nerf? It's a straight up buff to poor pilots and further encouragement for pro flyboys to continue farming infantry with no retaliation, sans another pilot or a tank who lands a lucky shell.


Reducing damage that was very rarely applied is not worth crying over.

plane flying away with 40-60 damage taken is simply going to erase all their work in 2-3 repair cycles and come back.


During which time the plane is not allowed to do anything but repair.

Me and some other posters here have argued that infantry should have a much greater impact at disrupting a plane's ability to operate through easier part destructions and added impulse shaking, but other people have been strongly resistant to the idea and think the status quo is fine now.


They're against the knee-jerk reaction of tripling the damage output for a single player.

A Support repairbro is always going to be useful, but the tools available for tank drivers now make him less valued. But thanks to the Emergency Repair nerf, Wrench Supports are definitely going to needed much more now, which is a very good thing.


A wrench is not going to replace Emergency Repair just as Emergency Repair isn't suitable for replacing the Wrench no matter how much people like to pretend so.

Each has their strengths and weaknesses.

Is ER going to be less useful? Yeah. Did that mean Wrench was useless before. Not at all.
Data Browser

Passive Spotting is the future!

With this, I'll rid MGO3 of infestation. Sans bad gameplay MGO3 will be torn asunder. And then it shall be free. People will suffer, of course - a phantom pain.

Reddit and Konami will rewrite the records... And I will be demonized in human memory. But... The thirst for good gameplay that I have planted will infest MGO3. No one can stop it now. The Rebalance Mod will unleash that thirst unto the future.


Are you a scrub?

If it flies, it dies™.

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18

Wednesday, March 15th 2017, 12:59am

Again, what is the point of this AA nerf? It's a straight up buff to poor pilots and further encouragement for pro flyboys to continue farming infantry with no retaliation, sans another pilot or a tank who lands a lucky shell.


Reducing damage that was very rarely applied is not worth crying over.

plane flying away with 40-60 damage taken is simply going to erase all their work in 2-3 repair cycles and come back.


During which time the plane is not allowed to do anything but repair.

Me and some other posters here have argued that infantry should have a much greater impact at disrupting a plane's ability to operate through easier part destructions and added impulse shaking, but other people have been strongly resistant to the idea and think the status quo is fine now.


They're against the knee-jerk reaction of tripling the damage output for a single player.

A Support repairbro is always going to be useful, but the tools available for tank drivers now make him less valued. But thanks to the Emergency Repair nerf, Wrench Supports are definitely going to needed much more now, which is a very good thing.


A wrench is not going to replace Emergency Repair just as Emergency Repair isn't suitable for replacing the Wrench no matter how much people like to pretend so.

Each has their strengths and weaknesses.

Is ER going to be less useful? Yeah. Did that mean Wrench was useless before. Not at all.
Full time wrench basically made Erep obsolete unless you are suddenly getting a MASSIVE amount of damage dumped on you - which you shouldn't because that means 3-4 guys are chucking at grens at you. At 10HP of boost it's totally obsolete if you have wrench support.

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19

Wednesday, March 15th 2017, 1:17am

Quoted

During which time the plane is not allowed to do anything but repair.

Wow, the plane is gone for another 10-12 seconds before it makes another pass. What a significant impact! :rolleyes:


Quoted

They're against the knee-jerk reaction of tripling the damage output for a single player.

They were also against the idea of 1-2 people crippling a plane, and that 26 seconds of combined small arms fire against a plane to destroy it is acceptable.


I brought tripling the damage against aircraft as an example of not addressing the real issue, which is infantry actively disrupting a plane's performance. Sheer damage isn't going to be enough, and part of the reason why I was against this AA nerf.



Full time wrench basically made Erep obsolete unless you are suddenly getting a MASSIVE amount of damage dumped on you - which you shouldn't because that means 3-4 guys are chucking at grens at you. At 10HP of boost it's totally obsolete if you have wrench support.

It's the fact that Emergency Repair existed as it did before (when it shouldn't) is what was so offensive to vehicle balance in general. Wrenching and teamwork is what should be inflating a tank's HP against AT, not a simple button press every 30 seconds

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20

Wednesday, March 15th 2017, 1:27am

Wait could people back up for a second? Were there changes to armor that I didn't see in the patch notes? Did emergency repair get nerfed or something?
Yeah, it's been slowly clawed back. First from 30 to 20, and now from 20 to 10.

That makes it sort of not terribly relevant in terms of tank meta. The St Chamond standoff is now clearly superior to the A7V assault for eg.