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  • "sid_tai" started this thread

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Wednesday, December 14th 2016, 1:35am

Biggest loser in the Dec patch: Cei Rigotti

I have made a quick analysis of damages of weapons pre and post patch. So far what I have found is that:
1: Buff to SMG dmg is pretty insignificant: now 7HK range of MP18 and Hellriegel and 8HK range of the Automatico has been increased by 2m.
2. Buff to LMG damage made Cei Rigotti pretty much obsolete. Previously Cei Rigotti excels from 22 to 36m, giving a faster TTK than 3HK medic rifles, while the LMGs and MP18 require 6+ shots kill. Now the 5HK range of LMG has been buffed up to 30 meters, giving Cei Rigotti only 6m of advantage. Combined with reduced spread spike of the LMGs, they are more likely to hit their first 5-6 shots.

I am now gonna give the Mondragon Optical a chance to replace Cei Rigotti as my mid range go-to medic weapon.

Discuss.

Zer0Cod3x

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Wednesday, December 14th 2016, 1:41am

3 BTK at 300 RPM gives you the same TTK as 5 BTK at 600 RPM.

I'm not sure what you're talking about.
something something Model 8 bestgun


How to ice an A-91

Next, wanna try adding a guy that you KNOW is bad, and just testing to see that? Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

PP-2000 added. Y'know, it's not that bad....

Yes, it comes in last so far, but that is mostly because I'm making it shoot at 100m ADS - Not Moving as one of the criteria. Even then, between 50-100m Not Moving, when you include Useability, it is only 1.37% worse than the MTAR-21. Within 50m then it even beats the A-91.

Have a look, vs. the A-91 Carbine:




Using it with Muzzle Brake and Compensator is a wash in terms of overall performance. Comp is SLIGHTLY more accurate, while MB is SLIGHTLY more easy to use. Their overall scores are basically tied, with MB just ahead. I guess either can be recommended.

But... You can't be counting for the fact that it takes 9 bullets to kill at "long" range... Don't you dare tell me my A-91 is worse than a 9 BTK 650 RPM mediocre PDW.

Also. Just go heavy barrel. The recoil is low enough.

Well, technically...

Comparing a PP2K with HB and an A-91 with comp and stubby (as you suggested in an earlier post), at 50m not moving, the A-91 is only better by 4 damage per hitrate. While at 75m and 100m, surprisingly the PP2K does better than the A-91 (I'm pretty damn surprised as well).

And 10m and 50m moving the PP2K also does more damage per hitrate than the A-91. At 25m the A-91 is only better by about half a bullet's damage as well.

In addition, the PP2K has a much larger mag size and substantially less recoil. And it looks hella awesome. So comparing the A-91 to a PDW is of some worth after all, as the PP2K is better (technically, not practically) than the A-91.

Mind blown.

I... I...

*cries in a corner*

Zer0Cod3x explained it very well. If you look at the raw numbers right here on Symthic Comparison, you can see how that happened:

A-91 vs PP-2000 | BF4 Weapon Comparison | Symthic

A-91's "23%" RPM advantage only afforded it 1 extra round.

Reload times are wash.

Velocities are wash.

V-Recoil are wash (and this is HBar on PP2k vs. A-91 without).

Hipfire and ADS - Moving are better on the PP2k, but it's a PDW and not the surprising part.

The surprising part is that, as equipped (and we see above that PP2k HBar has almost same V-Recoil as A-91 without HBar so why not?), the PDW performs better at 50 - 100m than a bloody Carbine. Why?

H-Recoil Spread, 0.525 vs. 0.45, advantage PP2k.

SIPS, 42% better on the PP2k.

And here is the most important part. ADS - Not Moving Spread, 0.35 vs. 0.2, 43% improvement.

Without HBar then of course the PP2k loses, which is why when I add all the attachments together for an Overall Ranking, it would slot below the A-91. Run HBar on it, though, then... I'm sorry

@Veritable
@Zer0Cod3x
I... I...
But...
Wha...
I AM HAVING AN EXISTENTIAL CRISIS IN SCHOOL BECAUSE OF YOU TWO.

FUCK YOU NERDS AND YOUR FANCY NUMBERS

SEXY RUSSIAN BULLPUPS FTW.

In all seriousness, thank you both so much for giving me the numbers. I still don't want to accept them. You have led the horse to water. I still need to drink.


NoctyrneSAGA

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Wednesday, December 14th 2016, 1:42am

Well the Cei Rigotti is still on par with something like the BAR for the first 30m, but yes the lead it used to have has been reduced.

It is almost as if the balance before had been finely tuned with very specific reasons for the decisions made.

Now we're at the risk of global powercreep because of some unhappy, misinformed players.



@Zer0Cod3x

OP is talking about the previous 22-36m zone where the LMGs had inferior TTK due to their 6 shot kill.

This zone has been changed to 30-36m.

Not world-ending, but it is pretty much half as large.
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This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "NoctyrneSAGA" (Dec 14th 2016, 1:47am)


  • "sid_tai" started this thread

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Wednesday, December 14th 2016, 1:45am

@Zer0Cod3x

dont forget we dont really spam fire the Cei rigotti at 300rpm, there are 2 frames for spread to decrease. But sure we can trade a little bit of spread for faster fire rate, but its harder to make comparison that way

@NoctyrneSAGA

I dont want to make conclusions about a global power creep such early, but I can see that BAR storm is going to be pretty dominant in mid range

Also regarding BAR vs Cei Rigotti, you dont have to worry about spread reset for LMG, plus you spit out more bullets in the same amount of time, so its more forgiving. Another plus for LMG, you get almost base spread automatically for the 6th bullet.

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "sid_tai" (Dec 14th 2016, 2:23am)


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Wednesday, December 14th 2016, 2:25am

Does this affect the Autoloading 8 variants ?

NoctyrneSAGA

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Wednesday, December 14th 2016, 2:58am

I doubt it.

Remember, these buffs to LMGs only helped it at closer ranges (hey, this phrase again!).

The Auto .35 handily beats them there still and will only lose out at longer ranges same as before.



Pre-patch would have the LMG 5-6 BTK shift at 22m.

Of course Cei Rigotti and Auto .35 are unchanged.
Data Browser

Passive Spotting is the future!

"Skill" may indeed be the most magical of words. Chant it well enough and any desire can be yours.

Are you a scrub?

If it flies, it dies™.