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  • "leptis" started this thread

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Friday, October 28th 2016, 8:05pm

What weapon variants mean (full auto)

Although already it have been discussed in some thread, as I need to know what I can expect from a weapon in the simulation by his "surname", I have calculated it systematically. That apply to full auto weapons (ASSAULT and LMGs). In each variant there are other advantages than the mechanic parameters. here, only mechanics questions.

The parameters that differ according to variant of the weapon are:

Spoiler Spoiler



Color code explained latter.

Numbers are not important now, only the pattern of the parameters that change within a weapon in relation to which we can consider basic because they are repeated in 2 variants. Here are only parameters changing because there are other ones (MAX values, FSMs...) that do not change within the weapon.

Quantification of the change that occurs in each variant in relation to basic parameters in each "surname" within a weapon is:



Blank values can be considered as "1" for each parameter. The numbers are relative to the common parameter value (0.70 means the parameter is 70% of the common value).

This allows to characterize the main feature that corresponds to a "surname", and the purpose (diagnosis) of the change. This is hyper-synthetic and more things could be said of each.



SUPPRESIVE: We can consider it as basic parameters. It is always equal to another variant. No singularity.

FACTORY + LOW WEIGHT-2: They are equal to Suppresive with better values of recovery (Recoil and Spread DEC). This is a little important feature because with the Spread negative model in 7-8 bullets bursts you reach the minimum value so there is nothing to recover. Some advantege in Recoil. Perhaps changing from HIPFIRE to ADS... or with microbursts....I donīt Know... In common circustancies (firing) as Suppresive.

EXPERIMENTAL + STORM: Variants with low recoil. Stable variants.

OPTICAL + TELESCOPIC: Variants with low spread ADS. Accurated at range.

TRENCH + LOW WEIGHT-1: Variants with good hipfiring. LOW WEIGHT-1 (only BAR) hasn't nothing to do with other LOW WEIGHT-2. Name not justified. It is a TRENCH.

Note that all discussion is between variants of the SAME weapon. So for instance "stable" doesn't mean the "most stable" among all weapons.

I can not ensure that these patterns apply to other weapons than full auto ones.

This post has been edited 6 times, last edit by "leptis" (Oct 29th 2016, 1:26pm)


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Friday, October 28th 2016, 8:14pm

Heh I was actually pondering if I should do something like this and write similar results, but looks like the job is already done ^^. That's well done stuff, I really like the coloring of tables and your visualizations in general! Only thing is missing is the effect of different attachments (eg. can have bayonet, or has better scope, or has smaller/larger magazine), but that'd be difficult to add here.

May I share some of this info on main site under general info? I might add something like this at some point so people could have quick and easy list of what the 'surnames' exactly could mean.

Edit: Gee are you a magician with Excel or do you spend too many hours to color/tidy up the tables to make them look like this? Like somebody said before, this is like spreadsheet porn ^^'.
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • InterimAegis - Weapon comparisons/scoring.
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • pmax - Statistical analysis of BF4 players/games.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

  • "leptis" started this thread

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Friday, October 28th 2016, 8:27pm

Heh I was actually pondering if I should do something like this and write similar results, but looks like the job is already done . That's well done stuff, I really like the coloring of tables and your visualizations in general! Only thing is missing is the effect of different attachments (eg. can have bayonet, or has better scope, or has smaller/larger magazine), but that'd be difficult to add here.

May I share some of this info on main site under general info? I might add something like this at some point so people could have quick and easy list of what the 'surnames' exactly could mean.

Edit: Gee are you a magician with Excel or do you spend too many hours to color/tidy up the tables to make them look like this? Like somebody said before, this is like spreadsheet porn '.


Of course you can use. I'm sure you provide me information with that "malicious" purpose. :) :) :)

That are basic variants. I edit and explain it.

Finally, I work without much visual work, just numbers and some conditional formats. Fix it at the end is easy because you know what you have to do (big Copy & Paste formats). :)

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Friday, October 28th 2016, 9:29pm



TRENCH + LOW WEIGHT-1: Variants with good hipfiring. LOW WEIGHT-1 (only BAR) hasn't nothig to do with other LOW WEIGHT-2. Name not justified. It is a TRENCH.

Hence its ingame designation: BAR 1918 Trench. It's only referred to as "low weight" in the files, quite probably an artifact from an earlier build before they swapped things around.
Zormau - Battlelog / Battlefield 4

Memorable quotes not taken yet:


Of course, this ignores the non-constant cross-sectional first moment of area across the chest as well as non-constant material properties of the boob; it would be difficult to perform a more detailed analysis (as in, I'd have to have a shape function AND I'd need to derive a function for elastic modulus as a function of lateral breast coordinate) but whatever. It's 2am and I'm lazy.


I always believed science should be very hands on experience.

You should also answer this question I had posed in that thread: Would you be willing to pay your surgeon more if he was going to use a chainsaw for the opening incision of surgery? Clearly using a chainsaw isn't truly suited for surgery but that doesn't really matter. If he's "skilled" enough to be able to use the wrong tools of the trade, he should be rewarded for that skill right?


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Sunday, October 30th 2016, 1:55am

Hence its ingame designation: BAR 1918 Trench. It's only referred to as "low weight" in the files, quite probably an artifact from an earlier build before they swapped things around.

Can you clarify what you mean by this? The other Low Weight variants of light machine guns have equal stats in hip fire.

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Sunday, October 30th 2016, 2:28am

There is no BAR Low Weight in BF1, there's a BAR Trench instead. Apparently the file names are outdated.
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Sunday, October 30th 2016, 2:40am

Ah. Got it.

I have yet to use the Trench variant of the BAR 1918, but I will try it later and see how it does compared to its other variants at closer ranges.

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Sunday, October 30th 2016, 2:24am

Ah. Got it.

I have yet to use the Trench variant of the BAR 1918, but I will try it later and see how it does compared to its other variants at closer ranges.


I've been using the BAR Storm and it's absurdly good. It's not my favourite MG and I definitely have more fun with others, but if I ever need to go super-tryhard-mode and just melt everyone I see, I pull out the BAR Storm. I feel the same way about the Mondragon Optical, it's just so easy to use and kills everything.
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Sunday, October 30th 2016, 2:50am

I have been using the M1909 Benet-Mercie Storm for a long while since I only use the variants with iron sights. My playstyle was to stick further back so that I could better compensate for the long time it takes for this light machine gun to return to lower spread due to its slow rate of fire.

I was unable to get five kills with it in a life as to complete the last challenge required for a medal in spite of playing very defensively though.

  • "leptis" started this thread

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Sunday, October 30th 2016, 12:33pm

Hence its ingame designation: BAR 1918 Trench. It's only referred to as "low weight" in the files, quite probably an artifact from an earlier build before they swapped things around.


I have used the names of the database I had. In this database there are two names (in fact three) for the same weapon.

WEAPON NAME: that is name of the weapon basic file.

SHOWN WEAPON NAME: that should be the game shows and it have an intermediate version structured as unitary word (with the character "_" to link words), surely to be used internally as CALL NAME

For instance, what is shown in the game as:

M1909 Benet-Mercie Storm

In the basic file is

HotchkissM1909_Customization_Stability

And

M1907_SL_Sweeper

is

WinchesterM1907_Customization_Auto

and many other examples (Selbstlader_M1916_Optical: MauserSL1916_Customization_Range; Autoloading_8_.35_Marksman: RemingtonModel8_Customization_Scope; Automatico_M1918_Factory: BerettaM1918_Customization... etc)

At some point (when the database was extracted) BAR 1918 TRENCH was called BAR_1918_LOW_WEIGHT as Call Name.

The stasts of Simthyc show the correct name (the one shown in the game).

This is not important because in the end the analysis has detected the anomaly.

This post has been edited 3 times, last edit by "leptis" (Oct 30th 2016, 12:45pm)