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  • "CReaperDorian" started this thread

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Tuesday, July 4th 2017, 9:06am

SMLE MKIII & Gewehr M.95: Infantry VS Carbine

So, when it comes to the SMLE MKIII and Gewehr M.95, what's really the point of the Infantry versions? I did enjoy Lawrence of Arabia's SMLE MKIII (which I'm sure is merely a reskinned Infantry variant) along with the Gewehr M.95 Infantry from the time I've spent with them, but now actually taking a better look at the stats, I think I'll most definitely have to switch over the Carbine variants. The Carbine variants have a third less hipfire spread along with a whopping half of the ADS movement spread. In fact, at just 0.5 degrees of maximum ADS movement spread, these two carbines are the most accurate guns in the game while moving. In theory, a proficient player armed with one of these carbines should be quite a nightmare with his/her ADADAD dancing.

Now, I figure they would have had lower muzzle velocities (and probably worse damage drop-off ranges), but they don't. Instead, if you choose the Infantry variants, you get 50% faster spread and recoil decrease. Wow (sarcasm)! Because apparently spread decrease means anything on a manual-action rifle, and recoil decrease will be of very limited use. Unless there's some extra sway/shift/jitter, of which is not shown in the charts, while chambering a new round that'll more likely throw you off target (recoil isn't going to be overly significant by itself), I can't really find much use in using the Infantry variants (aside from service stars).

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Tuesday, July 4th 2017, 9:29am

ADS time.

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Tuesday, July 4th 2017, 9:53pm

Spread reset only starts after the gun is ready to fire again, so if you want to shoot rapidly it would absolutely be a benefit, same concept applies to the Factory pump shotguns. Adding in faster ADS time, Infantry is far faster and more responsive than the Carbines, and they also retain the ability to zero the rifle, while Carbine's zeroing cannot be changed.

What really sells the Carbines for me though is that Moving Spread, that's a huge benefit. I regret not really using them until this week, and I've already fallen in love with the SMLE Carbine.
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  • "CReaperDorian" started this thread

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Wednesday, July 5th 2017, 2:45am

I guess I forgot about iron sights having a faster ADS time than the optical sight that's on the carbines. That'd be the biggest advantage, I guess. Or if you like playing under 2.00x magnification on a manual-action rifle for some reason.

Also, spread reset is irrelevant on manual-action rifles. They don't have any SIPS aside from when hipfiring, and the Carbine variants have a third less base hipfire spread than the Infantry variants. The actual rate of fire for these rifles is determined by the raw rate of fire in the files combined with the "bolt delay" time. If I'm correct, the "raw" rate of fire, which would affect spread and recoil recovery, is 350 round per minute. So, while the slower recoil recovery rate of the Carbine variants MAY possibly throw you off target a bit, the recoil will be completely settled before you can even fire your next shot. And added hipfire spread? That settles in under a third of a second.

I didn't know about the lack of zeroing, but to be fair, zeroing on anything less than a Marksman variant of a rifle will generally be of limited use.

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Wednesday, July 5th 2017, 3:05am

If anyone zeroes their iron sights to 150m or 300m, I'd like very much to hit them.

In all seriousness though, I really hate that you're forced to have your rifles zeroed at a selection of arbitrary distances. It's just another one of those casual elements this iteration can't seem to get enough of. Trying to learn to compensate for bullet drop due to gravity plus drag is non-linear enough until they decide to add a fucking turning point into the equation by forcing you to always be zeroed at anything but zero itself.

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Wednesday, July 5th 2017, 3:34am

If anyone zeroes their iron sights to 150m or 300m, I'd like very much to hit them.

In all seriousness though, I really hate that you're forced to have your rifles zeroed at a selection of arbitrary distances. It's just another one of those casual elements this iteration can't seem to get enough of. Trying to learn to compensate for bullet drop due to gravity plus drag is non-linear enough until they decide to add a fucking turning point into the equation by forcing you to always be zeroed at anything but zero itself.


You've clearly never operated a firearm before have you?

MFW incrementally adjustable iron sights are a "casual" element. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

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Wednesday, July 5th 2017, 4:23am

I guess I forgot about iron sights having a faster ADS time than the optical sight that's on the carbines. That'd be the biggest advantage, I guess. Or if you like playing under 2.00x magnification on a manual-action rifle for some reason.

Also, spread reset is irrelevant on manual-action rifles. They don't have any SIPS aside from when hipfiring, and the Carbine variants have a third less base hipfire spread than the Infantry variants. The actual rate of fire for these rifles is determined by the raw rate of fire in the files combined with the "bolt delay" time. If I'm correct, the "raw" rate of fire, which would affect spread and recoil recovery, is 350 round per minute. So, while the slower recoil recovery rate of the Carbine variants MAY possibly throw you off target a bit, the recoil will be completely settled before you can even fire your next shot. And added hipfire spread? That settles in under a third of a second.

I didn't know about the lack of zeroing, but to be fair, zeroing on anything less than a Marksman variant of a rifle will generally be of limited use.


I use flat 1x on every single iron sight in the game. Lens Sights are 2x, Suppressive and SLR Marksman are 3x, all other Marksman/Telescopic and SLR Sniper are 4x, BA Sniper is 5x.

No, spread reset still applies in situations like going from moving to stationary. Infantry may have worse Moving Spread, but it also recovers from it faster than Carbine, so is better if you want to move, then quickly stop to get a shot off, which I suspect is most shots. Carbine is better if you're shooting while moving.

Definitely not true, you underestimate the power of an Infantry rifle and the Periscope (for zoom, rangefinder, and spotting). While working on the Martini-Henry I had plenty of cases where I saw enemy glint across the map, checked the range (if a flag/etc wasn't near him), flipped my zeroing to 150m or 300m, and dropped him with iron sights. Works like a charm.


@Shalan

Zeroing a firearm to 0m is physically impossible. :pinch:
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Wednesday, July 5th 2017, 5:58am

Infantry may have worse Moving Spread, but it also recovers from it faster than Carbine


You might want to verify the math on this
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Wednesday, July 5th 2017, 6:21am

Infantry may have worse Moving Spread, but it also recovers from it faster than Carbine


You might want to verify the math on this


I see what you mean by that, you're talking total time combining both factors, which I was not. Carbine has less spread to recover from, but recovers slower. Infantry has more spread to recover from, but recovers faster.

I have no idea which has the fastest recovery time in practice when you go from strafing at full speed to stationary, but I wasn't trying to figure that out. Infantry has a faster recovery rate.
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  • "CReaperDorian" started this thread

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Wednesday, July 5th 2017, 6:26am

I never really thought about how spread decrease also goes into effect with base spread while moving and then stopping/slowing down. I always figured it just applied to SIPS. Does rate of fire or some other delay affect moving-to-still spread decrease? If not, and considering 50% movement speed (if that's still the maximum ADS speed of most guns in this title, never heard much about it), then the Carbine should only take about 0.0373 seconds to go from 0.25 degrees to zero degrees of spread while the Infantry variant should take about 0.0498 seconds to go from 0.5 degrees to zero degrees of spread.