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  • "BleedingUranium" started this thread

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51

Thursday, June 29th 2017, 12:28am

Inter-class weapon balance is sort of relevant, but remember that one of the main concepts behind the TTK buff is to keep guns' relationships to each other effectively the same as now. Well, except the Automatico and Hellriegel.

On another note, with a faster TTK some of the slower RoF guns should feel significantly better to use, as the relative gap between TTK of different weapons shrinks a bit, which, looking at things like the Huot, is definitely a good thing.
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52

Thursday, June 29th 2017, 12:33am

How about we turn the Hellriegel into the WW1 M240B? High DPS balanced by high horizontal recoil, FSM, and spread increase per shot, making it effective only up close.

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53

Thursday, June 29th 2017, 12:45am

How about we turn the Hellriegel into the WW1 M240B? High DPS balanced by high horizontal recoil, FSM, and spread increase per shot, making it effective only up close.


Isn't that the Automatico?
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54

Thursday, June 29th 2017, 12:48am

How about we turn the Hellriegel into the WW1 M240B? High DPS balanced by high horizontal recoil, FSM, and spread increase per shot, making it effective only up close.



Oh God, hard to imagine that happening due to its SMG nature and large mag size. But it already has quite high H-rec, FSM, and what we still need is SIPS scaling with ROF. And currently it is ineffective enough to use outside 30m.

Or alternatively, I have suggested that we turn MP-18 into a UMP-45, a CQC power house, and the Hellriegel into a PP-19, a spray-and-pray SMG with a large mag.

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55

Thursday, June 29th 2017, 1:07am

How about we turn the Hellriegel into the WW1 M240B? High DPS balanced by high horizontal recoil, FSM, and spread increase per shot, making it effective only up close.



Oh God, hard to imagine that happening due to its SMG nature and large mag size. But it already has quite high H-rec, FSM, and what we still need is SIPS scaling with ROF. And currently it is ineffective enough to use outside 30m.

Or alternatively, I have suggested that we turn MP-18 into a UMP-45, a CQC power house, and the Hellriegel into a PP-19, a spray-and-pray SMG with a large mag.


We have SIPS FSM scaling with RoF instead of SIPS for BF1's model. Makes for more immediate penalty compared to SIPS; hrec is your stacking penalty like SIPS was.

PP19 was shit then, and making the hellriegel total shit compared to its competition isn't a good solution. Since its RoF is already high, when we reduce MP18 to 4 min, leaving its min BTK as is and decreasing its max BTK by 1 and reducing hrec accordingly to make it an actual ranged gun (makes sense given how fucking huge it is) seems a bit better solution.

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"you obviously don't know what an argument is as there is only one person battling. Do you really fucking think I want subs? You think you can act all big and powerful just because you sit on a computer at least 6 hours a day like the probably nerdy unwanted retard you are with 4.3k subs? You think 4.3k subs is a lot? LOL you need medicine man. I don't want any subs as i just have a google account for other media and writing comments. Think twice before you act. You even said in your video you aren't that great of a player, and the comments agree you aren't. Maybe you should once again think twice before you act, stop being such an annoying, ignorant bastard that everyone wants to shut up, and god, literally, just shut up. Your voice gave me a headache :s"

"As a youtuber shouldn't be trying to be reeling in your viewers with exciting stuff being said not your boring ass commentary for your video"

"The more you watch his vid the dumber he gets I swear he's borderline autistic look I got shot behind cover beacuase thin sheets metal are unpenetrable. Bf4 is just as quiet and tactical as bf3 random explosion in the background . Player has dissconected from chat
You started playing bf3 and never touched bfc1/2. Please do yourself a favor and shutdown your generic cod channel down"

"Nice clickb8 Faggot w8ting for your shit tier video to disable comments . Fucking newfag cancer go play some cod you activisiom cock faggot"

"I don't see why he [MarbleDuck] always tries to shit on levelcap he is better and has a million more subs...and also "there isnt a best gun in she game there are guns that are better that others at different engagement distances" yes thats true and whichever is the best/most average at all of them is the "best gun""

"Marbleduck you don't know shit lol levelcap knows more than you do you cant talk about how someone puts up garbage when you do yourself your a newcomer to YouTube acting like you know shit step up in the food chain first then you have the right to talk otherwise your just a fish trying to compete with sharks"

"Why don't we just witness "LevelCap vs MarbleDuck" One on One both on Battlefield 3 and Battlefield 4 seen as there is so much Controversy about the Two Youtubers"

"stfu cunt, BF3 was way better end of discussion"

"Stfu man, you're be littleing the most looked upon Battlefield Youtuber. No one cares about you, how much of an ego you have, or quite frankly your opinion. It's a fucking game.... Does it really fucking matter? Pathetic man."

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"please talk like a normal person and not like a professional"

  • "BleedingUranium" started this thread

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56

Thursday, June 29th 2017, 1:09am

How about we turn the Hellriegel into the WW1 M240B? High DPS balanced by high horizontal recoil, FSM, and spread increase per shot, making it effective only up close.



Oh God, hard to imagine that happening due to its SMG nature and large mag size. But it already has quite high H-rec, FSM, and what we still need is SIPS scaling with ROF. And currently it is ineffective enough to use outside 30m.

Or alternatively, I have suggested that we turn MP-18 into a UMP-45, a CQC power house, and the Hellriegel into a PP-19, a spray-and-pray SMG with a large mag.


This is closer to what it should be. You really can't add any more spread or recoil to the Automatico or Hellriegel without making them (especially the latter) even more useless while also just being not fun to use. They simply can't be the same BTK as the MP 18 and Ribeyrolles, it doesn't work.


The Hellriegel, fitting its SMG/LMG hybrid status, could be high RoF, high capacity, very low recoil, with good spread/accuracy, but much lower raw DPS than the other SMGs. Assuming all hits are landing, it will definitely kill the slowest, but it makes up for that by being like the Huot in role, but with a more respectable RoF and more ammo. And as Duck just said, better ranged damage compared to the Automatico and MP 18 as well. Not only would this be better balanced, it would provide more interesting weapon choices and a new role, as well as being far more fitting to the real weapons' role/function.

The new 700rpm MG 14 should likely work much the same way as the Hellriegel, being a high RoF, high capacity weapon that feels like it's always on a Bipod, but with lower raw DPS than other options.


The Automatico would be really simple: Keep its BTK the same (though it could get a dropoff range extension if everything else is too), and in return undo some of the spread/recoil nerfs its received. This would make it balanced compared to everything else, and also feel nicer to use at the same time.
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57

Thursday, June 29th 2017, 12:47pm

How about we turn the Hellriegel into the WW1 M240B? High DPS balanced by high horizontal recoil, FSM, and spread increase per shot, making it effective only up close.



Oh God, hard to imagine that happening due to its SMG nature and large mag size. But it already has quite high H-rec, FSM, and what we still need is SIPS scaling with ROF. And currently it is ineffective enough to use outside 30m.

Or alternatively, I have suggested that we turn MP-18 into a UMP-45, a CQC power house, and the Hellriegel into a PP-19, a spray-and-pray SMG with a large mag.


We have SIPS FSM scaling with RoF instead of SIPS for BF1's model. Makes for more immediate penalty compared to SIPS; hrec is your stacking penalty like SIPS was.

PP19 was shit then, and making the hellriegel total shit compared to its competition isn't a good solution. Since its RoF is already high, when we reduce MP18 to 4 min, leaving its min BTK as is and decreasing its max BTK by 1 and reducing hrec accordingly to make it an actual ranged gun (makes sense given how fucking huge it is) seems a bit better solution.



Do you mean Hrec is the scaling for SIPS? We used to have Hrec increase AND SIPS increase for high ROF weapons, and we need both of them to barely balance out high ROF and low ROF weapons. If Hrec is used as proxy for SIPS scaling with ROF, then the storm variant would be like equipping a compensator without SIPS penalty and stubby grip with more SIPS reduction.

PP19 is shit, and I am not suggesting to make Hellriegel into shit tier. I am merely stating that we could use the features of PP19, which was more BTK up close, and fewer BTK at long range. In my post on one of the previous pages, I have outlined a proposal for weapon damage rework, which included the Hellriegel.

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58

Thursday, June 29th 2017, 12:57pm

How about we turn the Hellriegel into the WW1 M240B? High DPS balanced by high horizontal recoil, FSM, and spread increase per shot, making it effective only up close.



Oh God, hard to imagine that happening due to its SMG nature and large mag size. But it already has quite high H-rec, FSM, and what we still need is SIPS scaling with ROF. And currently it is ineffective enough to use outside 30m.

Or alternatively, I have suggested that we turn MP-18 into a UMP-45, a CQC power house, and the Hellriegel into a PP-19, a spray-and-pray SMG with a large mag.


This is closer to what it should be. You really can't add any more spread or recoil to the Automatico or Hellriegel without making them (especially the latter) even more useless while also just being not fun to use. They simply can't be the same BTK as the MP 18 and Ribeyrolles, it doesn't work.


The Hellriegel, fitting its SMG/LMG hybrid status, could be high RoF, high capacity, very low recoil, with good spread/accuracy, but much lower raw DPS than the other SMGs. Assuming all hits are landing, it will definitely kill the slowest, but it makes up for that by being like the Huot in role, but with a more respectable RoF and more ammo. And as Duck just said, better ranged damage compared to the Automatico and MP 18 as well. Not only would this be better balanced, it would provide more interesting weapon choices and a new role, as well as being far more fitting to the real weapons' role/function.

The new 700rpm MG 14 should likely work much the same way as the Hellriegel, being a high RoF, high capacity weapon that feels like it's always on a Bipod, but with lower raw DPS than other options.


The Automatico would be really simple: Keep its BTK the same (though it could get a dropoff range extension if everything else is too), and in return undo some of the spread/recoil nerfs its received. This would make it balanced compared to everything else, and also feel nicer to use at the same time.



I agree with the part about Hrec. With the Hrec required to balance out the Automatico as of right now, it is atrocious to use while ADS. I did not feel good at all. It feels worse than the SR-2 in BF4. I would much prefer a balanced "deviation" between SIPS and Hrec, which I think BF4 nailed with the SR-2 and the JS2.

As for the new LMG MG14, I surmise that it could become the new favorite. With the current popularity of the BAR (most used LMG) and the MG15 (second most used LMG), and if the LMG damage model remains unchanged, the MG14 is definitely the best of both worlds. High Hrec is not quite the deterrent to usage it seems, from the popularity of MG15 and Hellriegel.

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Thursday, June 29th 2017, 3:33pm

When people are discussing weapon popularity, are they taking into account the large section of the playerbase that don't own the DLC? I personally have found no use for the BAR storm now that the Chauchat exists. Other players gravitate to the hellriegal, but might have otherwise used the Rickroll if they had access to it. Then there's the fact that developing a mid range playstyle and managing your combat range is more complicated than just zerging into the nearest flag. Not trying to invalidate close range play or anything (if anything I avoid it because I suck at it), but sprinting into a flag might be easier for new players than relying on mid-long range accuracy and positioning.

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Friday, June 30th 2017, 10:46am

When people are discussing weapon popularity, are they taking into account the large section of the playerbase that don't own the DLC? I personally have found no use for the BAR storm now that the Chauchat exists. Other players gravitate to the hellriegal, but might have otherwise used the Rickroll if they had access to it. Then there's the fact that developing a mid range playstyle and managing your combat range is more complicated than just zerging into the nearest flag. Not trying to invalidate close range play or anything (if anything I avoid it because I suck at it), but sprinting into a flag might be easier for new players than relying on mid-long range accuracy and positioning.

I base my popularity statements on weapon kills on battlefield tracker. Newer players sprinting on the flag for CQC combat does not have influence on weapon kills because obviously most kills are obtained by the higher skilled players that kill them. However, I would argue that the lack of mid range effectiveness of weapons overall has led to more experienced players holding off until the less experienced has entered the "close range" required to reliably kill them. And this leads to the dominance of CQC weapons in terms of kills.