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11

Tuesday, June 13th 2017, 9:57pm

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15% is a big deal be it between 224 and 257, or between 770 and 880. I cannot believe that I actually have to explain this shit.

Consider this difference between 1RPM and 25RPM. That's a huge disparity, but the difference is only 24RPM. 25RPM is a usable Bolt Action; 1RPM is a shot every 60 seconds. The difference between 975 and 1000RPM? None, functionally.

It's almost like, as numbers get smaller, differences between them matter more.

Come on, are you really comparing 224 to 257RPM against 1 to 25RPM? Or 975 to 1000? The more appropriate comparison would be 21 vs 25 (hardly anyone here will know this), or 850 vs 1000RPM (even the average Joe can tell apart a F2K and Famas).

I'd argue the opposite of what you said, that as numbers get smaller, a 15% difference in RPM is a lot more harder to discern. Yes, it's still definitely perceivable, but the benefits to me only occur in that limited "Sweet Spot" range where an Auto Revolver can't easily do the job, but not really quite far away either (~30m?). At ranges past that on torso sized targets, I'm forced to slow down due to the recoil and almost match the "rhythm" of firing a 1916 Marksman. I have to do this even with the 1906 Sniper on things past 50-60m+, which has a whopping 300RPM and massively less recoil! And it probably explains why Mondragon Storm is my most used variant.

So admittedly, some of my own limited perceptions and biases clouding my judgement there. I'm not the best BF player, but it's going to take someone exceptionally skilled at firing 15% faster while still maintaining great accuracy at medium/long range to make the Mondragon truly the no-brainer choice on RPM alone.


The most important distinction is that the Mondragón can shoot with 0 SIPS at 225RPM, whereas the 1916 gets progressively more inaccurate at that range.

Just wondering, how are you able to do the maths to figure out the Mondragon's maximum RPM without any spread increase? Because even 4k kills into the 1916 Marksman, I'm still constantly juggling between that and the Mondragon variants, and if the 1916 Marksman's maximum RPM w/ 0 SIPS is much lower, I might just bite the bullet and make a fulltime switch.

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12

Tuesday, June 13th 2017, 10:03pm

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15% is a big deal be it between 224 and 257, or between 770 and 880. I cannot believe that I actually have to explain this shit.

Consider this difference between 1RPM and 25RPM. That's a huge disparity, but the difference is only 24RPM. 25RPM is a usable Bolt Action; 1RPM is a shot every 60 seconds. The difference between 975 and 1000RPM? None, functionally.

It's almost like, as numbers get smaller, differences between them matter more.

Come on, are you really comparing 224 to 257RPM against 1 to 25RPM? Or 975 to 1000? The more appropriate comparison would be 21 vs 25 (hardly anyone here will know this), or 850 vs 1000RPM (even the average Joe can tell apart a F2K and Famas).

I'd argue the opposite of what you said, that as numbers get smaller, a 15% difference in RPM is a lot more harder to discern. Yes, it's still definitely perceivable, but the benefits to me only occur in that limited "Sweet Spot" range where an Auto Revolver can't easily do the job, but not really quite far away either (~30m?). At ranges past that on torso sized targets, I'm forced to slow down due to the recoil and almost match the "rhythm" of firing a 1916 Marksman. Even with the 1906 Sniper, which has a whopping 300RPM and massively less recoil.

So admittedly, some of my own limited perceptions and biases clouding my judgement there. I'm not the best BF player, but it's going to take someone exceptionally skilled at firing 15% faster while still maintaining great accuracy at medium/long range to make the Mondragon truly the no-brainer choice on RPM alone.


The most important distinction is that the Mondragón can shoot with 0 SIPS at 225RPM, whereas the 1916 gets progressively more inaccurate at that range.

Just wondering, how are you able to do the maths to figure out the Mondragon's maximum RPM without any spread increase? Because even 4k kills into the 1916 Marksman, I'm still constantly juggling between that and the Mondragon variants, and if the 1916 Marksman's maximum RPM w/ 0 SIPS is much lower, I might just bite the bullet and make a fulltime switch.


Well that's provably wrong because 1 RPM is very discernable relative to even 10 rpm, nevermind 20-30 rpm.

Howevever you are right in that comparing 1 to 25 is not analogous to 224 vs 257. Absolute differences are actually irrelevant for what is perceived. What matters is the relative difference. You can sure as shit notice the difference between 1 rpm and 2 rpm. You definitely cannot notice the difference between 99 rpm and 100 rpm.

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Tuesday, June 13th 2017, 11:40pm

Just wondering, how are you able to do the maths to figure out the Mondragon's maximum RPM without any spread increase? Because even 4k kills into the 1916 Marksman, I'm still constantly juggling between that and the Mondragon variants, and if the 1916 Marksman's maximum RPM w/ 0 SIPS is much lower, I might just bite the bullet and make a fulltime switch.


60/((60/RoF)+(SIPS/SDPS))

In other words, the Selbstlader Marksman fires at min spread at the same rate as the Mondragon Storm / Sniper. But recoil is also a factor at range. I personally feel more comfortable with the Mondragon Storm and its close-quarters potential.

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Wednesday, June 14th 2017, 3:17am

So the 225RPM with 0 SIPS that Marbleduck mentioned is only in reference to the Mondragon Optical, and the optimal ROF for the Selb 1916 Factory/Optical/Marksman and Mondragon Storm/Sniper are all 199.

No wonder they all feel somewhat the same to me. Just really a matter of variants and the means to reaching 199RPM, except the Mondragon Optical which can fire 11.55% faster than that.

  • "Iplaysgames96" started this thread

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Wednesday, June 14th 2017, 4:52am

It's almost like, as numbers get smaller, differences between them matter more.


EDIT: just forget I said anything... Now I feel like a moron.

But on the topic of mondragon and 1916, I do feel as if I can shoot the mondragon at the max RPM of the selb1916 (225) and will have no spread; effectively out damaging it even at the 1916's max rpm.

I have the same feeling with the model 8 and the 300RPM guns (cei, m1907, 1906 luger) that I can shoot the model 8 at that 300RPM mark and have accurate shots whereas the 300 max guns are maxed out and loosing accuracy.

SO long story short, I am partial to the idea that the 257 of the mondragon is a significant difference compared to the 1916's 225

I am curious as to what determines when the spread starts to decrease in tandem with the RPM
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This post has been edited 3 times, last edit by "Iplaysgames96" (Jun 14th 2017, 5:04am)