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Is Frontlines headed to an early grave?

Can't get a title

Posts: 1,531

Date of registration
: Dec 23rd 2013

Platform: Xbox One

Location: The Land of Multitudinous Kangaroos

Reputation modifier: 13

Friday, April 21st 2017, 3:31pm

Conquest in a nutshell:

- One team zergs the crap out of the other
- Other team backcaps gimmie
- First team zergs gimmie
- Other team zergs the flag the first team was originally holding
- Repeat
- (If in competitive play: CQ might as well be a redeploy simulator)

Zerging is actually integral to Frontlines, so it actually works in a pub setting. It also is much more enjoyable to spectate in a competitive setting.
something something Model 8 bestgun

Quoted from "Pastafarianism"

Next, wanna try adding a guy that you KNOW is bad, and just testing to see that? Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

Quoted from "Pastafarianism"

Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

Yes, it comes in last so far, but that is mostly because I'm making it shoot at 100m ADS - Not Moving as one of the criteria. Even then, between 50-100m Not Moving, when you include Useability, it is only 1.37% worse than the MTAR-21. Within 50m then it even beats the A-91.

Have a look, vs. the A-91 Carbine:

Using it with Muzzle Brake and Compensator is a wash in terms of overall performance. Comp is SLIGHTLY more accurate, while MB is SLIGHTLY more easy to use. Their overall scores are basically tied, with MB just ahead. I guess either can be recommended.

Quoted from "Pastafarianism"

But... You can't be counting for the fact that it takes 9 bullets to kill at "long" range... Don't you dare tell me my A-91 is worse than a 9 BTK 650 RPM mediocre PDW.

Also. Just go heavy barrel. The recoil is low enough.

Quoted from "Zer0Cod3x"

Well, technically...

Comparing a PP2K with HB and an A-91 with comp and stubby (as you suggested in an earlier post), at 50m not moving, the A-91 is only better by 4 damage per hitrate. While at 75m and 100m, surprisingly the PP2K does better than the A-91 (I'm pretty damn surprised as well).

And 10m and 50m moving the PP2K also does more damage per hitrate than the A-91. At 25m the A-91 is only better by about half a bullet's damage as well.

In addition, the PP2K has a much larger mag size and substantially less recoil. And it looks hella awesome. So comparing the A-91 to a PDW is of some worth after all, as the PP2K is better (technically, not practically) than the A-91.

Mind blown.

Quoted from "Pastafarianism"

I... I...

*cries in a corner*

Quoted from "Veritable"

Zer0Cod3x explained it very well. If you look at the raw numbers right here on Symthic Comparison, you can see how that happened:

A-91 vs PP-2000 | BF4 Weapon Comparison | Symthic

A-91's "23%" RPM advantage only afforded it 1 extra round.

Velocities are wash.

V-Recoil are wash (and this is HBar on PP2k vs. A-91 without).

Hipfire and ADS - Moving are better on the PP2k, but it's a PDW and not the surprising part.

The surprising part is that, as equipped (and we see above that PP2k HBar has almost same V-Recoil as A-91 without HBar so why not?), the PDW performs better at 50 - 100m than a bloody Carbine. Why?

SIPS, 42% better on the PP2k.

And here is the most important part. ADS - Not Moving Spread, 0.35 vs. 0.2, 43% improvement.

Without HBar then of course the PP2k loses, which is why when I add all the attachments together for an Overall Ranking, it would slot below the A-91. Run HBar on it, though, then... I'm sorry

Quoted from "Pastafarianism"

@Veritable
@Zer0Cod3x
I... I...
But...
Wha...
I AM HAVING AN EXISTENTIAL CRISIS IN SCHOOL BECAUSE OF YOU TWO.

FUCK YOU NERDS AND YOUR FANCY NUMBERS

SEXY RUSSIAN BULLPUPS FTW.

In all seriousness, thank you both so much for giving me the numbers. I still don't want to accept them. You have led the horse to water. I still need to drink.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "Zer0Cod3x" (Apr 21st 2017, 4:37pm)

Posts: 3,291

Date of registration
: Apr 26th 2013

Platform: PS4

Location: Arizona, USA

Reputation modifier: 15

Friday, April 21st 2017, 6:44pm

Or an even simpler form: Conquest is the otherwise known as Backcapping Simulator or Cap the Gimmie Simulator.
To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question.

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the Sebstalder is quiet good since it can 3hit kill at any distanc ,but In my opinion i actually thikn the sweeper is better, its got a really really fast firerate that can beat alll those Noobmaticos, Helregall adn shitguns in close quarters , and its also really accurate out to like l;ong range,. overall great allround gun, jsut my 2$tho Smoked Salmon Best Salmon Posts: 1,024 Date of registration : Dec 25th 2012 Platform: PC Location: Yakima. WA Battlelog: Reputation modifier: 12 Friday, April 21st 2017, 6:45pm Quoted from "Mori4rte" Yet another bullshit mode which has nothing to do with battlefield. God forbid something breaks tradition and does something better than any prior mode has before, right? Platoon Marble Duck Hate Mail "you obviously don't know what an argument is as there is only one person battling. Do you really fucking think I want subs? You think you can act all big and powerful just because you sit on a computer at least 6 hours a day like the probably nerdy unwanted retard you are with 4.3k subs? You think 4.3k subs is a lot? LOL you need medicine man. I don't want any subs as i just have a google account for other media and writing comments. Think twice before you act. You even said in your video you aren't that great of a player, and the comments agree you aren't. Maybe you should once again think twice before you act, stop being such an annoying, ignorant bastard that everyone wants to shut up, and god, literally, just shut up. Your voice gave me a headache :s﻿" "As a youtuber shouldn't be trying to be reeling in your viewers with exciting stuff being said not your boring ass commentary for your video" "The more you watch his vid the dumber he gets I swear he's borderline autistic look I got shot behind cover beacuase thin sheets metal are unpenetrable. Bf4 is just as quiet and tactical as bf3 random explosion in the background . Player has dissconected from chat You started playing bf3 and never touched bfc1/2. Please do yourself a favor and shutdown your generic cod channel down" "Nice clickb8 Faggot w8ting for your shit tier video to disable comments . Fucking newfag cancer go play some cod you activisiom cock faggot" "I don't see why he [MarbleDuck] always tries to shit on levelcap he is better and has a million more subs...and also "there isnt a best gun in she game there are guns that are better that others at different engagement distances" yes thats true and whichever is the best/most average at all of them is the "best gun"" "Marbleduck you don't know shit lol levelcap knows more than you do you cant talk about how someone puts up garbage when you do yourself your a newcomer to YouTube acting like you know shit step up in the food chain first then you have the right to talk otherwise your just a fish trying to compete with sharks" "Why don't we just witness "LevelCap vs MarbleDuck" One on One both on Battlefield 3 and Battlefield 4 seen as there is so much Controversy about the Two Youtubers" "stfu cunt, BF3 was way better end of discussion" "Stfu man, you're be littleing the most looked upon Battlefield Youtuber. No one cares about you, how much of an ego you have, or quite frankly your opinion. It's a fucking game.... Does it really fucking matter? Pathetic man." "fuck you asshole, dont talk shit about total" "Wtf is your problem? You have no subs and he has millions, yet you pick on him like some kind of stubborn, ignorant, rude child born with a silver spoon is his mouth. It's easy to do that, for example... You said there was no background noise yet there is. You say you're a fairly good player, you're not." "please talk like a normal person and not like a professional" The Real Yugas Posts: 87 Date of registration : Feb 15th 2017 Platform: PC Battlelog: Reputation modifier: 2 Friday, April 21st 2017, 7:36pm Quoted from "Mori4rte" Yet another bullshit mode which has nothing to do with battlefield. Care to elaborate? Posts: 3,291 Date of registration : Apr 26th 2013 Platform: PS4 Location: Arizona, USA Reputation modifier: 15 Friday, April 21st 2017, 7:38pm Clearly if it isn't a 64 player clusterfuck then it isn't Battlefield. You heard it here, folks. To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question. Nope. Aim Assist or bust; here's why: Default Aim Assist Data Source code 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38  AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98 AccelerationMultiplier 5.0 AccelerationDamping 4.0 AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15 SquaredAcceleration 0.0 MaxAcceleration::Vec2 x 2.0 y 2.0 YawSpeedStrength 1.0 PitchSpeedStrength 1.0 AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2 x 1.0 y 1.2 AttractSoftZone 0.75 AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45 AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5 AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0 AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85 AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0 AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1 AttractMoveInputCap 0.0 AttractYawStrength 1.0 AttractPitchStrength 0.34 MaxToTargetAngle 45.0 MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0 ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0 SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0 SnapZoomTime 0.2 SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.2 SnapZoomPostTime 0.2 SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999 SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0 SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput 0.2 SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2 SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0 SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 1.2 SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid* CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0 No Slowdown Data Source code 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39  AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98 AccelerationMultiplier 5.0 AccelerationDamping 4.0 AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15 SquaredAcceleration 0.0 MaxAcceleration::Vec2 x 2.0 y 2.0 YawSpeedStrength 1.0 PitchSpeedStrength 1.0 AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2 x 1.0 y 1.2 AttractSoftZone 0.0 AttractUserInputMultiplier 1.0 AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom -1.0 AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0 AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.0 AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0 AttractStartInputThreshold 0.0 AttractMoveInputCap 0.0 AttractYawStrength 0.0 AttractPitchStrength 0.0 MaxToTargetAngle 45.0 MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0 ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0 SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0 SnapZoomTime 0.2 SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0 SnapZoomPostTime 0.0 SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999 SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0 SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0 SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2 SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0 SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5 SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid* CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0 DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0 No Auto Rotation Data Source code 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39   AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98 AccelerationMultiplier 5.0 AccelerationDamping 4.0 AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15 SquaredAcceleration 0.0 MaxAcceleration::Vec2 x 2.0 y 2.0 YawSpeedStrength 1.0 PitchSpeedStrength 1.0 AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2 x 1.0 y 1.2 AttractSoftZone 0.75 AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45 AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5 AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0 AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85 AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0 AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1 AttractMoveInputCap 0.0 AttractYawStrength 1.0 AttractPitchStrength 0.34 MaxToTargetAngle 45.0 MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0 ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0 SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0 SnapZoomTime 0.2 SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0 SnapZoomPostTime 0.0 SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999 SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0 SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0 SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2 SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0 SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5 SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid* CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0 DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0 Prepare your laughbox Quoted from "Zer0Cod3x" the Sebstalder is quiet good since it can 3hit kill at any distanc ,but In my opinion i actually thikn the sweeper is better, its got a really really fast firerate that can beat alll those Noobmaticos, Helregall adn shitguns in close quarters , and its also really accurate out to like l;ong range,. overall great allround gun, jsut my 2$ tho

Holy War? No Thanks.

Posts: 2,592

Date of registration
: Jul 25th 2013

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 15

Friday, April 21st 2017, 7:50pm

I do not see though what Soissons Frontlines brings to the table that a 32 player conquest round on most maps of BF4 did not deliver.

Basically it is still a zerg around one hotspot, you might just as well play Locker and Metro only with 32 players, although I would argue that this still plays out better because it frontlines can be broken up. I do not see why backcapping is an issue. It is a tactical choice and ensures a more dynamic game. Synergized well with the old ticket system, too.

The Real Yugas

Posts: 87

Date of registration
: Feb 15th 2017

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 2

Friday, April 21st 2017, 8:27pm

Quoted from "VincentNZ"

I do not see though what Soissons Frontlines brings to the table that a 32 player conquest round on most maps of BF4 did not deliver.

Basically it is still a zerg around one hotspot, you might just as well play Locker and Metro only with 32 players, although I would argue that this still plays out better because it frontlines can be broken up. I do not see why backcapping is an issue. It is a tactical choice and ensures a more dynamic game. Synergized well with the old ticket system, too.
Some people enjoy redeploying every five minutes to send one dude to stop your gimmie flag from being captured. That's okay. Personally, I don't and I'm glad they found a way to make backcapping pretty much completely non-viable. You can send a squad behind enemy lines in anticipation of the point being captured so you get a headstart but it doesn't directly benefit jacking off in the back of the map doing nothing while you could be helping your team.

Conquest is the shittiest gamemode on the entire planet. Backcapping is, like, super gay.

You all know deep down in your hearts that Frontlines is the superior gamemode. It does away with almost all of the base game BF1 bullshit. Shitty ticket system, aircraft, Behemoths, Elite classes. None of that shit is present in this mode and it's just happens to also be the best thing they've added to the entire series. Really makes you think, huh? It's also the single gamemode which I'd say approaches being comp viable.

TL;DR i love frontlines

Holy War? No Thanks.

Posts: 2,592

Date of registration
: Jul 25th 2013

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 15

Friday, April 21st 2017, 8:43pm

Repworthy. I wonder though why Metro and Locker with 32p did not take off competitively.

It is true that it ditches a lot of things that are inherently perceived as wrong in BF1, but it does emphasize a whole other lot of issues. It is still a stale mode, it is not dynamic and forces even more players onto one objective. It can also turn into a neverending match, because of too open and shitty map design. It also enhances the notion that being good at the game solely means being accurate.

I can see the appeal though. It is good for recreational gaming, you know one round of Frontlines after work without much disturbance. Mindless zerging, this is design that is always drawing people in.

Posts: 263

Date of registration
: Jun 9th 2012

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 10

Friday, April 21st 2017, 9:14pm

Quoted from "VincentNZ"

I do not see though what Soissons Frontlines brings to the table that a 32 player conquest round on most maps of BF4 did not deliver.

Basically it is still a zerg around one hotspot, you might just as well play Locker and Metro only with 32 players, although I would argue that this still plays out better because it frontlines can be broken up. I do not see why backcapping is an issue. It is a tactical choice and ensures a more dynamic game. Synergized well with the old ticket system, too.
Some people enjoy redeploying every five minutes to send one dude to stop your gimmie flag from being captured. That's okay. Personally, I don't and I'm glad they found a way to make backcapping pretty much completely non-viable. You can send a squad behind enemy lines in anticipation of the point being captured so you get a headstart but it doesn't directly benefit jacking off in the back of the map doing nothing while you could be helping your team.

Conquest is the shittiest gamemode on the entire planet. Backcapping is, like, super gay.

You all know deep down in your hearts that Frontlines is the superior gamemode. It does away with almost all of the base game BF1 bullshit. Shitty ticket system, aircraft, Behemoths, Elite classes. None of that shit is present in this mode and it's just happens to also be the best thing they've added to the entire series. Really makes you think, huh? It's also the single gamemode which I'd say approaches being comp viable.

TL;DR i love frontlines

I would argue that 32p rush with no planes no behemoths no elite classes would be a superior game mode, with proper telegraph placement and spawn locations of course. Another plus? We have already had it for a long time.

Disclaimer: I do not have premium and thus have never played frontlines.

Posts: 1,919

Date of registration
: Jan 12th 2014

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 14

Saturday, April 22nd 2017, 12:12am

Today on another Symthic sponsored episode of "Opinions as Facts"....

It's almost like conq has these big clanky things that are really good at stopping zergs from outside their effective range. Oh that's right, people wanted maps without them but then hate zerging.

This post has been edited 1 times, last edit by "tankmayvin" (Apr 22nd 2017, 12:19am)