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71

Saturday, April 29th 2017, 4:15pm

I'm also looking forward to the 1906 Luger sniper, as I really don't like the Mondragon sniper variant.

I wasn't overly fond of it initially either. But with more experience, I believe the Mondragon Sniper and BAR Telescopic to be the two most versatile guns in the game now.

Gecko99

thank mr skeltal

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72

Saturday, April 29th 2017, 8:25pm

I'm also looking forward to the 1906 Luger sniper, as I really don't like the Mondragon sniper variant.

I wasn't overly fond of it initially either. But with more experience, I believe the Mondragon Sniper and BAR Telescopic to be the two most versatile guns in the game now.

I don't know why but I can't hit shit with it, I honestly wonder if the scope is slightly off center for me because so often I shoot at someone center mass only for all the bullets to miss and land right next to him
Autoloading 8 .25 extended user.

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73

Sunday, April 30th 2017, 1:50am

I don't know why but I can't hit shit with it, I honestly wonder if the scope is slightly off center for me because so often I shoot at someone center mass only for all the bullets to miss and land right next to him


If you're referring to your first shots on target missing, I can't think why. But if you're referring to your follow up shots missing, it could be that it has the default Medic SIPS as opposed the superior one you get with the Marksman/Optical variants.

Gecko99

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Sunday, April 30th 2017, 2:47am

I don't know why but I can't hit shit with it, I honestly wonder if the scope is slightly off center for me because so often I shoot at someone center mass only for all the bullets to miss and land right next to him


If you're referring to your first shots on target missing, I can't think why. But if you're referring to your follow up shots missing, it could be that it has the default Medic SIPS as opposed the superior one you get with the Marksman/Optical variants.


It's probably the SIPS then, since I don't have the issue with the Mondragon Optical or Selbstlader M1916 Marksman.
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75

Sunday, April 30th 2017, 3:31am

I'm also looking forward to the 1906 Luger sniper, as I really don't like the Mondragon sniper variant.

I wasn't overly fond of it initially either. But with more experience, I believe the Mondragon Sniper and BAR Telescopic to be the two most versatile guns in the game now.


I agree. I've really started using the scoped BAR lately. Not playing scout, but staying in the support wheelhouse of say 30-60m, I can aim so much more precisely. Also see through clouds of smoke, gas, fog.

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76

Sunday, April 30th 2017, 4:07am

I agree. I've really started using the scoped BAR lately. Not playing scout, but staying in the support wheelhouse of say 30-60m, I can aim so much more precisely. Also see through clouds of smoke, gas, fog.


Oh yeah, I'd go on to single that one out as the best gun in the game. I also find that I need a scope to optimise my aim for Support/Medic. It's much easier to determine where your bullets are landing and track moving targets. Not to mention you get the bipod with this BAR, allowing you to effortlessly delete people (when you factor in the scope and RoF) at surprising ranges.

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Sunday, April 30th 2017, 4:40am

I'm also looking forward to the 1906 Luger sniper, as I really don't like the Mondragon sniper variant.

I wasn't overly fond of it initially either. But with more experience, I believe the Mondragon Sniper and BAR Telescopic to be the two most versatile guns in the game now.

Remember when the Hellreigel had 0.448 total horizontal recoil, a 1.8 FSM? I'm glad I got my service stars then.

Anyway, atleast Hellreigel defensive is a sexy, interesting variant unlike the Huot optical. Losing the bipod and the tremendous spread and recoil decrease compared to the LW Huot--I'm assuming-- seems like it will make the optical variant pretty useless. Would you trade all that for marginal better ADS moving spread?

Remember when the Hellreigel had 0.448 total horizontal recoil, a 1.8 FSM? I'm glad I got my service stars then.

Anyway, atleast Hellreigel defensive is a sexy, interesting variant unlike the Huot optical. Losing the bipod and the tremendous spread and recoil decrease compared to the LW Huot--I'm assuming-- seems like it will make the optical variant pretty useless. Would you trade all that for marginal better ADS moving spread?


Seriously. The Huot optical? Yawn.

It is kind of funny. Reading this thread, the Hellriegl sounds like a nerf, but here, you'd think it was a death ray:

Scoring the BF1 Assault SMGs + Slug Shotgun

Now I wonder how many folks decrying the Hellriegl are secretly drooling at the prospect of a 120-round version?

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Sunday, April 30th 2017, 5:50am

The BAR Telescopic is at the top of my list of things to try again after I'm done the Huot; best in-class damage, longest ranged scope, highest RoF, and a bipod? Yes please.

I only had about 10 kills with the Hellriegel (for the Codex) until the patch dropped, and after hearing so much about how its recoil is terrible and its repeated nerfs, I was expecting a lot of recoil. But uh, where is it? If this is what people consider a lot of recoil, I don't really know how to respond to that, but I'm definitely looking forward to the Defensive one.
Who Enjoys, Wins

Zer0Cod3x

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Sunday, April 30th 2017, 10:13am

I only had about 10 kills with the Hellriegel (for the Codex) until the patch dropped, and after hearing so much about how its recoil is terrible and its repeated nerfs, I was expecting a lot of recoil. But uh, where is it? If this is what people consider a lot of recoil, I don't really know how to respond to that, but I'm definitely looking forward to the Defensive one.

"Lots of recoil" is generally used in the sense that it can't hit things at long range because of its recoil, not that you can't control it.

If you want something to be really hard to control, you need to increase the FSM, i.e. making it non-linear. Perhaps you could also introduce a second or third shot recoil multiplier as well to further complicate things.
something something Model 8 bestgun


How to ice an A-91

Next, wanna try adding a guy that you KNOW is bad, and just testing to see that? Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

PP-2000 added. Y'know, it's not that bad....

Yes, it comes in last so far, but that is mostly because I'm making it shoot at 100m ADS - Not Moving as one of the criteria. Even then, between 50-100m Not Moving, when you include Useability, it is only 1.37% worse than the MTAR-21. Within 50m then it even beats the A-91.

Have a look, vs. the A-91 Carbine:




Using it with Muzzle Brake and Compensator is a wash in terms of overall performance. Comp is SLIGHTLY more accurate, while MB is SLIGHTLY more easy to use. Their overall scores are basically tied, with MB just ahead. I guess either can be recommended.

But... You can't be counting for the fact that it takes 9 bullets to kill at "long" range... Don't you dare tell me my A-91 is worse than a 9 BTK 650 RPM mediocre PDW.

Also. Just go heavy barrel. The recoil is low enough.

Well, technically...

Comparing a PP2K with HB and an A-91 with comp and stubby (as you suggested in an earlier post), at 50m not moving, the A-91 is only better by 4 damage per hitrate. While at 75m and 100m, surprisingly the PP2K does better than the A-91 (I'm pretty damn surprised as well).

And 10m and 50m moving the PP2K also does more damage per hitrate than the A-91. At 25m the A-91 is only better by about half a bullet's damage as well.

In addition, the PP2K has a much larger mag size and substantially less recoil. And it looks hella awesome. So comparing the A-91 to a PDW is of some worth after all, as the PP2K is better (technically, not practically) than the A-91.

Mind blown.

I... I...

*cries in a corner*

Zer0Cod3x explained it very well. If you look at the raw numbers right here on Symthic Comparison, you can see how that happened:

A-91 vs PP-2000 | BF4 Weapon Comparison | Symthic

A-91's "23%" RPM advantage only afforded it 1 extra round.

Reload times are wash.

Velocities are wash.

V-Recoil are wash (and this is HBar on PP2k vs. A-91 without).

Hipfire and ADS - Moving are better on the PP2k, but it's a PDW and not the surprising part.

The surprising part is that, as equipped (and we see above that PP2k HBar has almost same V-Recoil as A-91 without HBar so why not?), the PDW performs better at 50 - 100m than a bloody Carbine. Why?

H-Recoil Spread, 0.525 vs. 0.45, advantage PP2k.

SIPS, 42% better on the PP2k.

And here is the most important part. ADS - Not Moving Spread, 0.35 vs. 0.2, 43% improvement.

Without HBar then of course the PP2k loses, which is why when I add all the attachments together for an Overall Ranking, it would slot below the A-91. Run HBar on it, though, then... I'm sorry

@Veritable
@Zer0Cod3x
I... I...
But...
Wha...
I AM HAVING AN EXISTENTIAL CRISIS IN SCHOOL BECAUSE OF YOU TWO.

FUCK YOU NERDS AND YOUR FANCY NUMBERS

SEXY RUSSIAN BULLPUPS FTW.

In all seriousness, thank you both so much for giving me the numbers. I still don't want to accept them. You have led the horse to water. I still need to drink.


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80

Sunday, April 30th 2017, 11:22am

I only had about 10 kills with the Hellriegel (for the Codex) until the patch dropped, and after hearing so much about how its recoil is terrible and its repeated nerfs, I was expecting a lot of recoil. But uh, where is it? If this is what people consider a lot of recoil, I don't really know how to respond to that, but I'm definitely looking forward to the Defensive one.



I'm glad you said that, I feel pretty much exactly the same way. Although in my case, I think I got around 200 kills with it after its first nerf and somehow concluded it wasn't good enough.


Then 2-3 weeks ago, I decided to give it another go to see whether the Defensive would actually be worth unlocking. I was amazed by just how effective it was. The recoil was surprisingly manageable and it was a dream to burst fire at medium ranges. You just can't ignore its RoF and 60 round mag.


I really can't understand how a lot of people here say that it's trash and the MP18 outclasses it. Nor can I understand how I found it mediocre before the last two nerfs weakened it to what it is now.


Maybe the extra recoil makes it feel less like a toy and more like a powerhouse now. Maybe it's because the Automatico has been quite substantially nerfed since. Maybe I went in with too high expectations initially, but with much lower expectations more recently. Maybe I just flat-out sucked at the game at first.