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Posts: 2,015

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: Jan 12th 2014

Platform: PC

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11

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 1:32am

The Huot slots in at a very weird place for me relative to the BM, Madsen and the Lewis to me. I'd rather play to the strengths of one of those three.

Posts: 3,695

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: Mar 19th 2014

Platform: Xbox One

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12

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 2:16am

The Huot slots in at a very weird place for me relative to the BM, Madsen and the Lewis to me. I'd rather play to the strengths of one of those three.


That pretty much sums up my feelings on it. If any one of those others didn't exist I'd feel far more inclined to use the Huot, and I want to like it.
Who Enjoys, Wins

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: Aug 24th 2016

Platform: PS4

Location: QLD, Australia/ NC, USA

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13

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 2:17am

I'm just having a frustrating time grinding up to the Huot in general. In the beginning I loved the BAR Storm still love the look but performance of late have been woeful. The Benet Storm is nice but for me its like playing in a jail yard where I'm trying to keep max distance from everyone.

Then very recently I chose the MG15 as my general purpose machine gun as its just fast enough up close, and has a nice beaten zone at ranges where I wish to suppress an enemy in contact with an team mate. But truth be told I just couldn't find an support weapon that I can pick up and enjoy using.

But honestly having had so much fun practising with the Model 8 as a medic, grinding the support class really does feel like a grind.
I hope it's worth it as I did the same with the assault class and was disappointed with the Helreigel. Between the MP experimental, Automatico storm and now the slug shotgun, it feels weak at all ranges rather than a good general purpose assault weapon.

I like how players curse when someone killed them with a hellreigel however.

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: Jan 12th 2014

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14

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 2:23am

I'm just having a frustrating time grinding up to the Huot in general. In the beginning I loved the BAR Storm still love the look but performance of late have been woeful. The Benet Storm is nice but for me its like playing in a jail yard where I'm trying to keep max distance from everyone.

Then very recently I chose the MG15 as my general purpose machine gun as its just fast enough up close, and has a nice beaten zone at ranges where I wish to suppress an enemy in contact with an team mate.

But honestly having had so much fun practising with the Model 8 as a medic, grinding the support class really does feel like a grind.
I hope it's worth it as I did the same with the assault class and was disappointed with the Helreigel. Between the MP experimental, Automatico storm and now the slug shotgun, it feels weak at all ranges rather than a good general purpose assault weapon.

I like how players curse when someone killed them with a hellreigel however.
Assault has been the biggest grind for me. I'm still not maxed ranked in it yet. I only spawn assault for going after tanks or on a handful of maps.

Support is fairly easy to level because....well it's support. Ride bitch with a good tanker and keep him repaired. Levels about as fast as the tanker class for a good tanker. You're getting 50 points for every one of the crew kills, plus your kills, plus repair points, plus flag caps.

Posts: 127

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: Aug 24th 2016

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15

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 2:52am

I'm just having a frustrating time grinding up to the Huot in general. In the beginning I loved the BAR Storm still love the look but performance of late have been woeful. The Benet Storm is nice but for me its like playing in a jail yard where I'm trying to keep max distance from everyone.

Then very recently I chose the MG15 as my general purpose machine gun as its just fast enough up close, and has a nice beaten zone at ranges where I wish to suppress an enemy in contact with an team mate.

But honestly having had so much fun practising with the Model 8 as a medic, grinding the support class really does feel like a grind.
I hope it's worth it as I did the same with the assault class and was disappointed with the Helreigel. Between the MP experimental, Automatico storm and now the slug shotgun, it feels weak at all ranges rather than a good general purpose assault weapon.

I like how players curse when someone killed them with a hellreigel however.
Assault has been the biggest grind for me. I'm still not maxed ranked in it yet. I only spawn assault for going after tanks or on a handful of maps.

Support is fairly easy to level because....well it's support. Ride bitch with a good tanker and keep him repaired. Levels about as fast as the tanker class for a good tanker. You're getting 50 points for every one of the crew kills, plus your kills, plus repair points, plus flag caps.


In my own experiences with assault lev 0-3 was ok, 3-7 was painful, but from 7-10 I got into the assault pioneer or anti armor mindset that my AT gun, dynamite and AT grenades were my platoons assets, the smg was purely something to keep me alive to employ those assets. Things got much easier. Also I found a vehicle destroy was 250 pts regardless of whether its a car or tank. I shot a lot of armoured cars.

Also find a buddy that also needs to grind, even with AT guns and sixpack grenades 2 dudes hunting a tank is much more rewarding than doing it solo.

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: Apr 26th 2013

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16

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 7:46am

'Skill cannons' have been redefined. Rather than strictly emphasizing technical gun skill like previous titles, Battlefield 1 has highlighted that intelligence and positioning are more important keys to success rather than how well one aims or controls recoil.

Skill-based weapons are inherently accurate and reward accuracy to a high extent. Technical prowess is now an afterthought rather than being at the forefront of what makes a weapon a 'skill cannon.' High accuracy is ideal for 1v1 engagements because, in general, the player who puts the most damage on target quicker will win the engagement.

Now high rate of fire weapons would seem to be the most beneficial in this circumstance because of theoretical DPS, but these weapons are usually plagued with high horizontal recoil, higher spread increase and slower spread decrease to cap their true effectiveness at close range. At its relevant, medium range, the Huot is a straight laser beam that takes advantage of its incredibly low recoil values, superb negative spread increase in ADS and Hip Stances, lighting fast spread decrease in ADS and Hip stances, and top notch minimum spread (one of the only sub 0.2X spread MGs without a scope/ optic).

- 0.106× -4/ - 0.225× -4
0.18
0.28
^
0.08 <—¦—> 0.08

12.75/ 27
To Aim Assist or not to Aim Assist, that is the question.

Nope. Aim Assist or bust; here's why:

Default Aim Assist Data

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.75
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 1.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.34
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.2
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 1.2
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0

No Slowdown Data

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AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.0
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 1.0
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom -1.0
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.0
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 0.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.0
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.0
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
    DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0


No Auto Rotation Data

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 AccelerationInputThreshold 0.98
    AccelerationMultiplier 5.0
    AccelerationDamping 4.0
    AccelerationTimeThreshold 0.15
    SquaredAcceleration 0.0
    MaxAcceleration::Vec2
        x 2.0
        y 2.0
    YawSpeedStrength 1.0
    PitchSpeedStrength 1.0
    AttractDistanceFallOffs::Vec2
        x 1.0
        y 1.2
    AttractSoftZone 0.75
    AttractUserInputMultiplier 0.45
    AttractUserInputMultiplier_NoZoom 0.5
    AttractOwnSpeedInfluence 0.0
    AttractTargetSpeedInfluence 0.85
    AttractOwnRequiredMovementForMaximumAttract 0.0
    AttractStartInputThreshold 0.1
    AttractMoveInputCap 0.0
    AttractYawStrength 1.0
    AttractPitchStrength 0.34
    MaxToTargetAngle 45.0
    MaxToTargetXZAngle 45.0
    ViewObstructedKeepTime 0.0
    SnapZoomLateralSpeedLimit 1000.0
    SnapZoomTime 0.2
    SnapZoomPostTimeNoInput 0.0
    SnapZoomPostTime 0.0
    SnapZoomReticlePointPriority 999
    SnapZoomAutoEngageTime 0.0
    SnapZoomBreakTimeAtMaxInput -1.0
    SnapZoomBreakMaxInput 0.2
    SnapZoomBreakMinAngle 90.0
    SnapZoomSpamGuardTime 0.5
    SoldierBackupSkeletonCollisionData *nullGuid*
    CheckBoneCenterOnlyDistance 40.0
    DisableForcedTargetRecalcDistance 7.0

Prepare your laughbox

the Sebstalder is quiet good since it can 3hit kill at any distanc ,but In my opinion i actually thikn the sweeper is better, its got a really really fast firerate that can beat alll those Noobmaticos, Helregall adn shitguns in close quarters , and its also really accurate out to like l;ong range,. overall great allround gun, jsut my 2$ tho


Zer0Cod3x

Can't get a title

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Posts: 1,531

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: Dec 23rd 2013

Platform: Xbox One

Location: The Land of Multitudinous Kangaroos

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17

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 10:40am

Huot: has the fastest TTK out of all the LMGs at range.

M1909: has the best sustained damage out of all the LMGs at range (over its mag size, that is).

Lewis: 50 accurate rounds.

BAR, Madsen, MG15: don't use them at range.
something something Model 8 bestgun


How to ice an A-91

Next, wanna try adding a guy that you KNOW is bad, and just testing to see that? Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

PP-2000 added. Y'know, it's not that bad....

Yes, it comes in last so far, but that is mostly because I'm making it shoot at 100m ADS - Not Moving as one of the criteria. Even then, between 50-100m Not Moving, when you include Useability, it is only 1.37% worse than the MTAR-21. Within 50m then it even beats the A-91.

Have a look, vs. the A-91 Carbine:




Using it with Muzzle Brake and Compensator is a wash in terms of overall performance. Comp is SLIGHTLY more accurate, while MB is SLIGHTLY more easy to use. Their overall scores are basically tied, with MB just ahead. I guess either can be recommended.

But... You can't be counting for the fact that it takes 9 bullets to kill at "long" range... Don't you dare tell me my A-91 is worse than a 9 BTK 650 RPM mediocre PDW.

Also. Just go heavy barrel. The recoil is low enough.

Well, technically...

Comparing a PP2K with HB and an A-91 with comp and stubby (as you suggested in an earlier post), at 50m not moving, the A-91 is only better by 4 damage per hitrate. While at 75m and 100m, surprisingly the PP2K does better than the A-91 (I'm pretty damn surprised as well).

And 10m and 50m moving the PP2K also does more damage per hitrate than the A-91. At 25m the A-91 is only better by about half a bullet's damage as well.

In addition, the PP2K has a much larger mag size and substantially less recoil. And it looks hella awesome. So comparing the A-91 to a PDW is of some worth after all, as the PP2K is better (technically, not practically) than the A-91.

Mind blown.

I... I...

*cries in a corner*

Zer0Cod3x explained it very well. If you look at the raw numbers right here on Symthic Comparison, you can see how that happened:

A-91 vs PP-2000 | BF4 Weapon Comparison | Symthic

A-91's "23%" RPM advantage only afforded it 1 extra round.

Reload times are wash.

Velocities are wash.

V-Recoil are wash (and this is HBar on PP2k vs. A-91 without).

Hipfire and ADS - Moving are better on the PP2k, but it's a PDW and not the surprising part.

The surprising part is that, as equipped (and we see above that PP2k HBar has almost same V-Recoil as A-91 without HBar so why not?), the PDW performs better at 50 - 100m than a bloody Carbine. Why?

H-Recoil Spread, 0.525 vs. 0.45, advantage PP2k.

SIPS, 42% better on the PP2k.

And here is the most important part. ADS - Not Moving Spread, 0.35 vs. 0.2, 43% improvement.

Without HBar then of course the PP2k loses, which is why when I add all the attachments together for an Overall Ranking, it would slot below the A-91. Run HBar on it, though, then... I'm sorry

@Veritable
@Zer0Cod3x
I... I...
But...
Wha...
I AM HAVING AN EXISTENTIAL CRISIS IN SCHOOL BECAUSE OF YOU TWO.

FUCK YOU NERDS AND YOUR FANCY NUMBERS

SEXY RUSSIAN BULLPUPS FTW.

In all seriousness, thank you both so much for giving me the numbers. I still don't want to accept them. You have led the horse to water. I still need to drink.


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: Nov 29th 2016

Platform: PS4

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18

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 2:02pm

As others have said, IMO the Hotchkiss and Lewis make this gun feel like a case of diminishing returns.

Off topic, but is there any real advantage to putting LMG'S into semi-auto mode, vs tap firing while in full auto?

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: Oct 30th 2014

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19

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 2:53pm

Huot: has the fastest TTK out of all the LMGs at range.

M1909: has the best sustained damage out of all the LMGs at range (over its mag size, that is).

Lewis: 50 accurate rounds.

BAR, Madsen, MG15: don't use them at range.


Don't use bar at range you say?

Why I get rekted by them from 60 meters away.

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: Jan 30th 2017

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20

Tuesday, February 7th 2017, 5:44pm

I would say that what makes the Huot a "skill" gun is the fact that is has no mitigating factors to make up for a loss of accuracy on the user's part. What I mean is, it is an extremely accurate gun, and it really doesn't have any other benefits. It doesn't have high damage or a high rate of fire to make missing shots less punishing.