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31

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 3:31am


Medic rifles are balanced not really because there's a lack of Storm variations (Mondragon, M1907 Sweeper, and Auto8 Extended have this), but because they fulfill their niches exceptionally well at what they do.


Like you said, the returns on using something like a MP18 or Lewis is so awfully skewed that most people would ditch them if given the chance. DICE has already buffed the LMGs massively since release, and it still hasn't changed people from using the BAR. Likewise, the Automatico excels so well at CQC combat out to 30m that there is really little reason to use anything else. It's going to take a much more drastic buff to all LMGs to encourage a healthy variety of use, and I'm wondering if DICE is going to take the easy way out and continue to nerf the BAR more, or actually push LMG effectiveness up to the BAR standards. At the same time, nothing is ever going to dilute usage of the Automatico unless you do something to drastically nerf its lightning TTK.


Sheer killing speed is the elephant in the room for Assault and Support weapons here, which is what the BAR and Automatico have

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32

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 6:18am

I think that MP18 Experimental requires a deep rework somewhat like this:
Damage max/min from 23/13.5 to 19/15
Drop-off start/end from 12m/43m to 20m/50m
Muzzle velocity from 420m/s to 580m/s
Vrec from 0.38 to 0.23
Hipfire from 1/1/1 stand and 1.5/1/1 to 2/2/2 and 2.5/2/2

So you'll now have a weapon that is really interesting at medium and long-medium ranges, but bad at close range. So it's a tradeoff like M1903 Experimental for Recon.
Currently it's burst-fire mode has no real use for me - MP18 optical, IMHO, is better in all ways. What a point for a burst fire with 550RPM, 420m/s muzzle velocity, average accuracy and pretty weak damage model?
Sadly, this will never be possible, as DICE has this odd adherence to weapons sharing the same cartridge having the same ballistics, to the detriment of interesting balance, IMO.


I mean, I get it... but c'mon, it's a game. :S

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33

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 7:27am

Caliber-based damage is fine, really it's great because it provides a layer of consistency and authenticity; the MP18 (Experimental)'s problem isn't damage, it's mainly velocity and possibly recoil. Also, having the repeated First Shot Recoil/Spread Multiplier at the end of each burst. While "pace your bursts" is a fine idea in concept, and a good thing to do, the FSMs may be too punishing right now, especially with it not being an especially high-damage weapon.

Seeing as some other presets have extra traits, like the M1907 Extended also getting a Vertical Recoil reduction, could the Experimental-burst-mode preset also get an FSM(s) reduction, in addition to moving them to the third shot?
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34

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 9:39am

Caliber-based damage is fine, really it's great because it provides a layer of consistency and authenticity; the MP18 (Experimental)'s problem isn't damage, it's mainly velocity and possibly recoil. Also, having the repeated First Shot Recoil/Spread Multiplier at the end of each burst. While "pace your bursts" is a fine idea in concept, and a good thing to do, the FSMs may be too punishing right now, especially with it not being an especially high-damage weapon.

Seeing as some other presets have extra traits, like the M1907 Extended also getting a Vertical Recoil reduction, could the Experimental-burst-mode preset also get an FSM(s) reduction, in addition to moving them to the third shot?
Isn't it currently on 3rd shot?

I think that MP18 Experimental requires a deep rework somewhat like this:
Damage max/min from 23/13.5 to 19/15
Drop-off start/end from 12m/43m to 20m/50m
Muzzle velocity from 420m/s to 580m/s
Vrec from 0.38 to 0.23
Hipfire from 1/1/1 stand and 1.5/1/1 to 2/2/2 and 2.5/2/2

So you'll now have a weapon that is really interesting at medium and long-medium ranges, but bad at close range. So it's a tradeoff like M1903 Experimental for Recon.
Currently it's burst-fire mode has no real use for me - MP18 optical, IMHO, is better in all ways. What a point for a burst fire with 550RPM, 420m/s muzzle velocity, average accuracy and pretty weak damage model?
Sadly, this will never be possible, as DICE has this odd adherence to weapons sharing the same cartridge having the same ballistics, to the detriment of interesting balance, IMO.


I mean, I get it... but c'mon, it's a game. :S
Well, it was used with 2 types of cartridge:

9x19mm Parabellum - current in BF1 "9x19mm_SMG"
7.63×25mm Mauser - so, maybe this for experimental, maybe "Mauser763x25mm_experiment"
A little fantasy, but why not?
Sorry for my bad english - it's not my native language and I have difficulties with acquiring speaking/writing practice in my country. If I accidently insult you or say something wrong - I'm sorry, you can feel free to correct me.

This post has been edited 2 times, last edit by "kazei009" (Jan 24th 2017, 9:50am)


NoctyrneSAGA

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35

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 9:41am

it's a game.


Yes.

This is why spread is wildly exaggerated.
Data Browser

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If it flies, it dies™.

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36

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 9:49am

Caliber-based damage is fine, really it's great because it provides a layer of consistency and authenticity; the MP18 (Experimental)'s problem isn't damage, it's mainly velocity and possibly recoil. Also, having the repeated First Shot Recoil/Spread Multiplier at the end of each burst. While "pace your bursts" is a fine idea in concept, and a good thing to do, the FSMs may be too punishing right now, especially with it not being an especially high-damage weapon.

Seeing as some other presets have extra traits, like the M1907 Extended also getting a Vertical Recoil reduction, could the Experimental-burst-mode preset also get an FSM(s) reduction, in addition to moving them to the third shot?
Isn't it currently on 3rd shot?


It is, that's what I meant by "in addition to". The English language sucks. :pinch:
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VincentNZ

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37

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 11:31am

Caliber-based damage is fine, really it's great because it provides a layer of consistency and authenticity; the MP18 (Experimental)'s problem isn't damage, it's mainly velocity and possibly recoil. Also, having the repeated First Shot Recoil/Spread Multiplier at the end of each burst. While "pace your bursts" is a fine idea in concept, and a good thing to do, the FSMs may be too punishing right now, especially with it not being an especially high-damage weapon.

Seeing as some other presets have extra traits, like the M1907 Extended also getting a Vertical Recoil reduction, could the Experimental-burst-mode preset also get an FSM(s) reduction, in addition to moving them to the third shot?


Yeah what you say is true, but I would say the TSM applied to burst mode is another thing that puts people off, it is just so unintuitive, your first two shots are on point and then your third, when your spread really kicks in and you would take time to readjust your aim your thrown off totally. If you then continue to shoot at max RPM it just gets worse and worse and worse. :D

C0llis

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38

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 2:46pm

If it's like BF4 then the TSM is only applied if you drop below max RPM.

With the "queuing"(/buffering) of inputs in BF1 it's pretty easy to stay at max RPM with burst and semi weapons, so you are not likely to get hit by TSM multiple times when chaining bursts.

Things people said

And reading Youtube comments still gives me Turbo Cancer.

It really is quite frustrating when Helen Keller sets up her LMG in the only doorway in/out of an area.

What kind of question is that? Since when is cheese ever a bad idea?

Hardline is a fun and sometimes silly Cops and Robbers sorta thing and I think that's great. Or it would be if it didn't suck.

VincentNZ

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39

Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 3:36pm

I never knew that, so if you are clicking at the optimal rate, you will be awarded with no recoil multiplier at all?

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Tuesday, January 24th 2017, 9:00pm

If that's the case, it's news to me.
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