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Posts: 260

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: Jun 5th 2015

Platform: Xbox One

Location: Hoth

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11

Friday, November 18th 2016, 10:04pm

That would be the most intuitive thing IMO, and players wouldn't get killed before they can see what's happening (which would happen if they spawned in as soon as they chose the spawn point, unless 2 seconds of spawn invulnerability was implemented, which I think we can agree that no-one wants).

Really? Why would spawn protection be a bad thing?

I recall that the player who spawned cannot use their weapon immediately for the duration of the invulnerability.

Because it is frustrating af to encounter invulnerable people.

I remember once in Bf4, on Dragon Valley. I was following an enemy, which climbed up one of the ladders to one of the towersin the middle objectives.
Once I reach the top, he's running in a straight line across the orange roof. Impossible to miss. As I open fire, a squadmate spawns directly behind him, absorbing many shots, before they are alerted and escape by jumping down.

What did I do wrong? Nothing. Even if I started shooting the moment I saw him (which I didn't because I wanted a better shot) it could have happened.

A safe spawn can be ensured by talking with the squadguy or, in Bf4, with the camera.

The spawn protection doesn't help much either; you usually end up dead anyway if you spawn in relying on it, it's just akwardly delayed a bit.

signature 2.2

Things I support
ammo regen pls

Quoted from "NoctyrneSAGA"

_____
When I play with it [Autoloading 8] I feel like I am batman taking out 1 after 1 baddie while they feel helpless and don't know who is talking out their mates.
Remove 3D spotting. Itís a mechanic that rewards bad eyesight.
Wanna help your team by sneaking through enemy territory to provide spawns? THIS IS NOT TEAMWORK FGT I HOPE YOU RUN OUT OF MOTION BALLS TOO EARLY TO BE SUCCESSFUL
Wanna be Javelin squad but only have two guys? BETTER NOT GET YOUR SOFLAM KILLED FGT THIS IS NOT TEAMWORK WITHOUT A SUPPORT DUDE DROPPING AMMO ON YOU EVERY 2 MINUTES
Please post your best M1916 clips Magazines *fixed*.


DICE pls

Squadmate Healthbars in the HUD
Minor console QoL improvements
Ping Tool idea
"Wants to talk" tag for squad menu
Adding Suppression Confirmation
Spotting suggestions

Posts I should finish sometime:
Squad priority vehicle system (and anti stealing suggestion)
Scoring system flaws (and concept)
Battlefield definition
New helicopter idea
Suppression rework
Flow, immersion and fun in battlefield
Specializations: ideas and system rework
Gadget reworks and ideas
Why limited infinite ammo would be awesome
Other bitesize ideas



Zer0Cod3x

Can't get a title

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: Dec 23rd 2013

Platform: Xbox One

Location: The Land of Multitudinous Kangaroos

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12

Saturday, November 19th 2016, 12:13am

Really? Why would spawn protection be a bad thing?

I recall that the player who spawned cannot use their weapon immediately for the duration of the invulnerability.

Spawn protection screws over the other team.

Do you remember spawn bombing from BF4? Part of the reason why spawn bombing was so infuriating was that you'd shoot an invulnerable target, which not only wasted ammo in your magazine, but would also block bullets intended for the non-invulnerable target.


I'd much rather that you don't spawn at all, than have spawn invulnerability.
something something Model 8 bestgun


How to ice an A-91

Next, wanna try adding a guy that you KNOW is bad, and just testing to see that? Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

Example: PP-2000 (god I so wanna love this gun, and yet...)

PP-2000 added. Y'know, it's not that bad....

Yes, it comes in last so far, but that is mostly because I'm making it shoot at 100m ADS - Not Moving as one of the criteria. Even then, between 50-100m Not Moving, when you include Useability, it is only 1.37% worse than the MTAR-21. Within 50m then it even beats the A-91.

Have a look, vs. the A-91 Carbine:




Using it with Muzzle Brake and Compensator is a wash in terms of overall performance. Comp is SLIGHTLY more accurate, while MB is SLIGHTLY more easy to use. Their overall scores are basically tied, with MB just ahead. I guess either can be recommended.

But... You can't be counting for the fact that it takes 9 bullets to kill at "long" range... Don't you dare tell me my A-91 is worse than a 9 BTK 650 RPM mediocre PDW.

Also. Just go heavy barrel. The recoil is low enough.

Well, technically...

Comparing a PP2K with HB and an A-91 with comp and stubby (as you suggested in an earlier post), at 50m not moving, the A-91 is only better by 4 damage per hitrate. While at 75m and 100m, surprisingly the PP2K does better than the A-91 (I'm pretty damn surprised as well).

And 10m and 50m moving the PP2K also does more damage per hitrate than the A-91. At 25m the A-91 is only better by about half a bullet's damage as well.

In addition, the PP2K has a much larger mag size and substantially less recoil. And it looks hella awesome. So comparing the A-91 to a PDW is of some worth after all, as the PP2K is better (technically, not practically) than the A-91.

Mind blown.

I... I...

*cries in a corner*

Zer0Cod3x explained it very well. If you look at the raw numbers right here on Symthic Comparison, you can see how that happened:

A-91 vs PP-2000 | BF4 Weapon Comparison | Symthic

A-91's "23%" RPM advantage only afforded it 1 extra round.

Reload times are wash.

Velocities are wash.

V-Recoil are wash (and this is HBar on PP2k vs. A-91 without).

Hipfire and ADS - Moving are better on the PP2k, but it's a PDW and not the surprising part.

The surprising part is that, as equipped (and we see above that PP2k HBar has almost same V-Recoil as A-91 without HBar so why not?), the PDW performs better at 50 - 100m than a bloody Carbine. Why?

H-Recoil Spread, 0.525 vs. 0.45, advantage PP2k.

SIPS, 42% better on the PP2k.

And here is the most important part. ADS - Not Moving Spread, 0.35 vs. 0.2, 43% improvement.

Without HBar then of course the PP2k loses, which is why when I add all the attachments together for an Overall Ranking, it would slot below the A-91. Run HBar on it, though, then... I'm sorry

@Veritable
@Zer0Cod3x
I... I...
But...
Wha...
I AM HAVING AN EXISTENTIAL CRISIS IN SCHOOL BECAUSE OF YOU TWO.

FUCK YOU NERDS AND YOUR FANCY NUMBERS

SEXY RUSSIAN BULLPUPS FTW.

In all seriousness, thank you both so much for giving me the numbers. I still don't want to accept them. You have led the horse to water. I still need to drink.


VincentNZ

Holy War? No Thanks.

(2,282)

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: Jul 25th 2013

Platform: PC

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13

Saturday, November 19th 2016, 12:22am

I honestly never really minded the spawn protection in BF4. The spawns were immediate and the guy spawned was disoriented. Sure enough, a lot of times you got killed by the new spawn, and I purposely spawned on people under pressure to kill the guy and solve the situation but all of this is way better than what we have in BF1, where a guy can spawn as much as two seconds after death of his mate and 5m behind you, whilst you might be in the middle of reloading a stripper clip and 4 single bullets.

BF4 spawn protection is nothing compared to that.

BF4 flag spawns were better too, you would spawn close to the flag but still in a safe spot and with cover available for most maps. You also did not share the spawn point with the enemy team.

Posts: 1,535

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: Sep 7th 2016

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14

Saturday, November 19th 2016, 2:08am

The spawner doesn't gain anything from it because he can't see anything during the time, from his point of view his model could just as well spawn when his camera arrives, and the enemy players have to stare an invulnerable model for 2 seconds and then kill the player, which isn't fun or interesting.

The scenario you are referring to for spaning is not the case for "Battlefield 1" though. The body of the player does not immediately appear after choosing to spawn on a squad member, so there is no period for which there is no vision.



Do you remember spawn bombing from BF4?

Why was that scenario called "spawn bombing"?

C0llis

Up and down. Bounce all around

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: Apr 15th 2013

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Location: Sweden

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15

Saturday, November 19th 2016, 2:36am

The spawner doesn't gain anything from it because he can't see anything during the time, from his point of view his model could just as well spawn when his camera arrives, and the enemy players have to stare an invulnerable model for 2 seconds and then kill the player, which isn't fun or interesting.

The scenario you are referring to for spaning is not the case for "Battlefield 1" though. The body of the player does not immediately appear after choosing to spawn on a squad member, so there is no period for which there is no vision.
Didn't you read the post I was replying to?

The context is "[...]spawning the soldier on map already when they select the spawnpoint".

Things people said

And reading Youtube comments still gives me Turbo Cancer.

It really is quite frustrating when Helen Keller sets up her LMG in the only doorway in/out of an area.

What kind of question is that? Since when is cheese ever a bad idea?

Hardline is a fun and sometimes silly Cops and Robbers sorta thing and I think that's great. Or it would be if it didn't suck.

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: Sep 7th 2016

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16

Saturday, November 19th 2016, 2:48am

Yeah of course, since you were replying to me.