Welcome to symthic forums! We would love if you'd register!
You don't have to be expert in bit baking, everyone is more than welcome to join our community.

You are not logged in.

Hey! If this is your first visit on symthic.com, also check out our weapon damage charts.
Currently we have charts for Battlefield 3, Call of Duty: Black Ops 2, Medal of Honor: Warfighter and Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3

  • "Novan Leon" started this thread

Posts: 27

Date of registration
: Dec 19th 2011

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 8

  • Send private message

1

Friday, November 4th 2016, 5:59pm

SPECULATION: What are the ramifications of HC increasing bullet damage to 140% instead of reducing health to 60% like previous games?

In previous Battlefield games, Hardcore Mode decreased player health to 60%. This decreased the TTK of all weapons significantly. However, in Battlefield 1, the yet-to-be-released Hardcore Mode appears to be slightly different. Instead of decreasing player health to 60%, they're planning on leaving player health at 100% and increasing bullet damage specifically. Originally they were planning on increasing bullet damage by 200%, but now it looks like they're planning on increasing it by 140%.

My question is, what are the ramifications of these changes?

Some thoughts:
  • Grenades, tank shells, bombs, traps, tear gas and all other NON-BULLET damage will remain the same as standard mode. I imagine this is to keep these things from being overpowered in HC.
  • A bullet will need to do 43+ damage (standard 1.7 multiplier) or 40+ damage (1.8 bolt action / slug multiplier) to score a single-shot kill to the head. I believe the only guns that meet these requirements are the bolt action rifles and revolvers, which means one-shot headshots will still primarily belong to scouts in HC.
  • With 80-100 base damage, most bolt action (i.e. scout) rifles will be able to one-shot-kill (OSK) to the torso and upper arms. Limbs will not OSK.
  • The Gewehr M.95, Martini-Henry Infantry and Russian 1895 Trench scout rifles do less than 80 damage at max range and will not be able to OSK except with a headshot at those ranges.
  • The Bodeo 1889, Bulldog, Gasser M1870, Howdah Pistol, No. 3 Revolver and Auto Revolver will be able to OSK to the head at close ranges.
  • As far as I can tell, all other guns in the game will require more than one hit to kill.

Posts: 1,535

Date of registration
: Sep 7th 2016

Platform: PC

Location: Toronto

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 5

  • Send private message

2

Friday, November 4th 2016, 6:08pm

With the amount of health for Hardcore essentially set to just over 71% of normal, two shots to the upper torso at range from the Mondragon, the Selbstlader M1916, and the Selbstlader 1906 will not be able to kill an opponent with full health.

Posts: 162

Date of registration
: Jun 10th 2012

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 7

  • Send private message

3

Friday, November 4th 2016, 7:32pm

Quoted

With the amount of health for Hardcore essentially set to just over 71% of normal, two shots to the upper torso at range from the Mondragon, the Selbstlader M1916, and the Selbstlader 1906 will not be able to kill an opponent with full health.


And this will ruin this game for me and force me to return to BF4

Dmr in hardcore have to be 2shoot kill at any range to be balanced...

used to be #3 in the World in RAWR Kills:)

Posts: 62

Date of registration
: Dec 17th 2015

Platform: PC

Location: Marine Barracks, Washington D.C.

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 3

  • Send private message

4

Friday, November 4th 2016, 7:44pm

That's going to make more work needed by the Symthic guys to calculate weapons on HC now isn't it?...

Posts: 1,535

Date of registration
: Sep 7th 2016

Platform: PC

Location: Toronto

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 5

  • Send private message

5

Friday, November 4th 2016, 7:48pm

Surely not, since it is just a different number from the 60 health people are used to.

100 / 140 * 100 = 71.43 Relative Health Approximately

See? Not much work there at all. I can't speak for the backend of everything here though.

Miffyli

Symthic Developer

(6,584)

Posts: 3,715

Date of registration
: Mar 21st 2013

Platform: PC

Location: __main__, Finland

Reputation modifier: 17

  • Send private message

6

Friday, November 4th 2016, 8:00pm

Adding HC graphs to page is no biggie. Like ChineseToTheBone said, we'll just set the health in TTK/BTK calculations correspond to virtual health players have in HC.
Totally didn't have HC graphs online for a second at lrelease, possibly with the correct values
Links to users' thread list who have made analytical/statistical/mathematical/cool posts on Symthic:
  • 3VerstsNorth - Analysis of game mechanics in BF4 (tickrates, effects of tickrate, etc)
  • leptis - Analysis of shotguns, recoil, recoil control and air drag.
  • Veritable - Scoring of BF4/BF1 firearms in terms of usability, firing and other mechanics.
  • Miffyli - Random statistical analysis of BF4 battlereports/players and kill-distances. (list is cluttered with other threads).
Sorry if your name wasn't on the list, I honestly can't recall all names : ( . Nudge me if you want to be included

Posts: 62

Date of registration
: Dec 17th 2015

Platform: PC

Location: Marine Barracks, Washington D.C.

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 3

  • Send private message

7

Friday, November 4th 2016, 8:51pm

And thus, Symthic has proven they always will be the superior site for finding information; something too good to be true...

marbleduck

Smoked Salmon Best Salmon

(1,514)

Posts: 1,024

Date of registration
: Dec 25th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Yakima. WA

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 13

  • Send private message

8

Friday, November 4th 2016, 10:22pm

Dmr in hardcore have to be 2shoot kill at any range to be balanced...

>hardcore
>balance

pick one

Platoon Marble Duck

Hate Mail

"you obviously don't know what an argument is as there is only one person battling. Do you really fucking think I want subs? You think you can act all big and powerful just because you sit on a computer at least 6 hours a day like the probably nerdy unwanted retard you are with 4.3k subs? You think 4.3k subs is a lot? LOL you need medicine man. I don't want any subs as i just have a google account for other media and writing comments. Think twice before you act. You even said in your video you aren't that great of a player, and the comments agree you aren't. Maybe you should once again think twice before you act, stop being such an annoying, ignorant bastard that everyone wants to shut up, and god, literally, just shut up. Your voice gave me a headache :s"

"As a youtuber shouldn't be trying to be reeling in your viewers with exciting stuff being said not your boring ass commentary for your video"

"The more you watch his vid the dumber he gets I swear he's borderline autistic look I got shot behind cover beacuase thin sheets metal are unpenetrable. Bf4 is just as quiet and tactical as bf3 random explosion in the background . Player has dissconected from chat
You started playing bf3 and never touched bfc1/2. Please do yourself a favor and shutdown your generic cod channel down"

"Nice clickb8 Faggot w8ting for your shit tier video to disable comments . Fucking newfag cancer go play some cod you activisiom cock faggot"

"I don't see why he [MarbleDuck] always tries to shit on levelcap he is better and has a million more subs...and also "there isnt a best gun in she game there are guns that are better that others at different engagement distances" yes thats true and whichever is the best/most average at all of them is the "best gun""

"Marbleduck you don't know shit lol levelcap knows more than you do you cant talk about how someone puts up garbage when you do yourself your a newcomer to YouTube acting like you know shit step up in the food chain first then you have the right to talk otherwise your just a fish trying to compete with sharks"

"Why don't we just witness "LevelCap vs MarbleDuck" One on One both on Battlefield 3 and Battlefield 4 seen as there is so much Controversy about the Two Youtubers"

"stfu cunt, BF3 was way better end of discussion"

"Stfu man, you're be littleing the most looked upon Battlefield Youtuber. No one cares about you, how much of an ego you have, or quite frankly your opinion. It's a fucking game.... Does it really fucking matter? Pathetic man."

"fuck you asshole, dont talk shit about total"

"Wtf is your problem? You have no subs and he has millions, yet you pick on him like some kind of stubborn, ignorant, rude child born with a silver spoon is his mouth. It's easy to do that, for example... You said there was no background noise yet there is. You say you're a fairly good player, you're not."

"please talk like a normal person and not like a professional"

Posts: 162

Date of registration
: Jun 10th 2012

Platform: PC

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 7

  • Send private message

9

Friday, November 4th 2016, 10:30pm

Hardcore was balanced in BF 3 and BF4:

Bars 1 shot kill at almost any range
DMR 1 headshot kill or 2 body shots kill
Assault Riffles and LMG 3-4 shots kill
7.62mm Assault Riffles and LMG 2-3 shots kill
SMG 4-6 shots kill
Shotgun pump action 1 shot kill close...

used to be #3 in the World in RAWR Kills:)

marbleduck

Smoked Salmon Best Salmon

(1,514)

Posts: 1,024

Date of registration
: Dec 25th 2012

Platform: PC

Location: Yakima. WA

Battlelog:

Reputation modifier: 13

  • Send private message

10

Friday, November 4th 2016, 10:40pm

Hardcore was balanced in BF 3 and BF4:


I mean, that can't be the dumbest thing I've ever heard in my entire life.

It probably comes close, though.

Anyway, I have a nice video on why Hardcore's balance is so terrible:


Platoon Marble Duck

Hate Mail

"you obviously don't know what an argument is as there is only one person battling. Do you really fucking think I want subs? You think you can act all big and powerful just because you sit on a computer at least 6 hours a day like the probably nerdy unwanted retard you are with 4.3k subs? You think 4.3k subs is a lot? LOL you need medicine man. I don't want any subs as i just have a google account for other media and writing comments. Think twice before you act. You even said in your video you aren't that great of a player, and the comments agree you aren't. Maybe you should once again think twice before you act, stop being such an annoying, ignorant bastard that everyone wants to shut up, and god, literally, just shut up. Your voice gave me a headache :s"

"As a youtuber shouldn't be trying to be reeling in your viewers with exciting stuff being said not your boring ass commentary for your video"

"The more you watch his vid the dumber he gets I swear he's borderline autistic look I got shot behind cover beacuase thin sheets metal are unpenetrable. Bf4 is just as quiet and tactical as bf3 random explosion in the background . Player has dissconected from chat
You started playing bf3 and never touched bfc1/2. Please do yourself a favor and shutdown your generic cod channel down"

"Nice clickb8 Faggot w8ting for your shit tier video to disable comments . Fucking newfag cancer go play some cod you activisiom cock faggot"

"I don't see why he [MarbleDuck] always tries to shit on levelcap he is better and has a million more subs...and also "there isnt a best gun in she game there are guns that are better that others at different engagement distances" yes thats true and whichever is the best/most average at all of them is the "best gun""

"Marbleduck you don't know shit lol levelcap knows more than you do you cant talk about how someone puts up garbage when you do yourself your a newcomer to YouTube acting like you know shit step up in the food chain first then you have the right to talk otherwise your just a fish trying to compete with sharks"

"Why don't we just witness "LevelCap vs MarbleDuck" One on One both on Battlefield 3 and Battlefield 4 seen as there is so much Controversy about the Two Youtubers"

"stfu cunt, BF3 was way better end of discussion"

"Stfu man, you're be littleing the most looked upon Battlefield Youtuber. No one cares about you, how much of an ego you have, or quite frankly your opinion. It's a fucking game.... Does it really fucking matter? Pathetic man."

"fuck you asshole, dont talk shit about total"

"Wtf is your problem? You have no subs and he has millions, yet you pick on him like some kind of stubborn, ignorant, rude child born with a silver spoon is his mouth. It's easy to do that, for example... You said there was no background noise yet there is. You say you're a fairly good player, you're not."

"please talk like a normal person and not like a professional"