The problem of the support class in BF1

Jais

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Monday, August 29th 2016, 5:17pm

Once again, the support class seems to be a poorly thought out grab-bag of unneeded and unviable gadgets and weapons. As far as I can tell, the developers seem to be regarding the support class as the following three aspects:

The LMG guy. Yes, one class needs to carry the LMGs in the game and the support class is the ideal candidate, here. The problem is that, from a competitive standpoint, semi-autos and bolt actions shit on LMGs from medium range and up, and even properly bipodded the LMG user is just sniper bait (as he's always been, but now sniper rifles are much easier to use).
The ammo guy. Again, someone has to carry the ammo and it's (almost) always been the support guy's main role. However, this is a thankless and often unneeded job. As anyone who has even a remote interest in the competitive scene can tell you, nobody in their right mind is going to volunteer to bring ammo to the battlefield when money or even a win is on the line - simply put, another medic or anti-tank class is that much more valuable. The "ammo guy" role is made even more redundant in BF1 since everything from horses to light tanks can now shit bullets.
The tripwire guy. This is where I get a little depressed. The support class had access to claymores in BF3 and BF4, but now DICE seems to have doubled down on this gadget and made it one of the central pillars of the support class in BF1. Why? This is a gadget which relies purely on enemy stupidity to work, feels cheap and rage-inducing to be killed by and is completely worthless from a competitive perspective. Why, DICE? Why does the support class get 3 different kinds of tripwire bombs? Who ever asked for this?

Now, there are still some gadgets that have yet to be revealed but already I can guess what they are. Mortars, and several different variations of them: normal, gas, incendiary and maybe a smoke version for good measure. Time will tell whether these mortars are effective or not, but it doesn't exactly look promising, for two reasons:

Past BF versions have been pretty shit. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that since a mortar is by definition an indirect fire weapon, it is subject to immense feelings of rage and cheapness if it gets too effective. It's a bloody fine line to cross, and so far it hasn't been a really viable gadget.
The BF1 setting. We know already the mortar isn't remotely operated (and it wouldn't make much sense in a WW1 setting anyway), so that's one strike against it. Strike two is that enemy players no longer show up on the minimap when firing their weapon. Unless DICE is completely redoing the targeting mechanic (a 3D bird's eye view?) I can't really see it being that effective.

So there we have it, the support class is now even more worthless than before. Unless DICE pulls out a miracle gadget that rivals the rocket gun, spawn beacon or revive tool in usefulness, he's yet again relegated to a competitive purgatory. But this doesn't matter, does it? Because now we have three different kinds of claymores to play with!

This post by "NoctyrneSAGA" (Monday, August 29th 2016, 6:35pm) has been deleted by user "yugas42" (Monday, August 29th 2016, 7:30pm) with the following reason: rule 5

potetr

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Monday, August 29th 2016, 6:40pm

Actually, I think the devs think of the support kit as the control/sustained fire guy. (LMGs suppress, suppression can be used as area denial)

Quoted from "Jais"

The tripwire guy. This is where I get a little depressed. The support class had access to claymores in BF3 and BF4, but now DICE seems to have doubled down on this gadget and made it one of the central pillars of the support class in BF1. Why? This is a gadget which relies purely on enemy stupidity to work, feels cheap and rage-inducing to be killed by and is completely worthless from a competitive perspective. Why, DICE? Why does the support class get 3 different kinds of tripwire bombs? Who ever asked for this?

The new versions of the tripmine will actually accomplish working as reliable area denial. Atleast the incendiary one. I think it is a clever gadget, even if it's spotted and detonated you can't run past it immediately. I wonder why they included a gas one, that seems very unreliable as many players carry gas masks.

Quoted from "Jais"

Past BF versions have been pretty shit. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that since a mortar is by definition an indirect fire weapon, it is subject to immense feelings of rage and cheapness if it gets too effective. It's a bloody fine line to cross, and so far it hasn't been a really viable gadget.

I wish they'd turn the mortar into a tool instead of a weapon. E.g. incendiary area denial. Then it could be effective without being unfun. Regarding it not being remote controlled, maybe it is now more like a launcher, instead of being a placed weapon.

Still, due to the support still being the ammo box kit, I'm not sure the situation will change from Bf4 (unless the ammo box gains some more magic powers). We'll have to wait until the game releases to know for sure, though why they wouldn't showcase it as an effective class in the beta (by including some good gadgets) I'm not sure.

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ammo regen pls

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Remove 3D spotting. ItÂs a mechanic that rewards bad eyesight.

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Wanna help your team by sneaking through enemy territory to provide spawns? THIS IS NOT TEAMWORK FGT I HOPE YOU RUN OUT OF MOTION BALLS TOO EARLY TO BE SUCCESSFUL
Wanna be Javelin squad but only have two guys? BETTER NOT GET YOUR SOFLAM KILLED FGT THIS IS NOT TEAMWORK WITHOUT A SUPPORT DUDE DROPPING AMMO ON YOU EVERY 2 MINUTES

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NoctyrneSAGA

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Monday, August 29th 2016, 6:52pm

Quoted from "potetr"

The new versions of the tripmine will actually accomplish working as reliable area denial. Atleast the incendiary one. I think it is a clever gadget, even if it's spotted and detonated you can't run past it immediately. I wonder why they included a gas one, that seems very unreliable as many players carry gas masks.

Forcing players to hipfire while you are set up far away ADSing with a bipod seems like a really good idea.

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BleedingUranium

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Monday, August 29th 2016, 6:56pm

I definitely think you're underestimating MGs.

As for gadgets, the issue I see is the lack of a direct-fire gadget. Recon had this problem in BF4, where it's only direct, offensive gadgets were the PLD (which can only assist in damage, not damage) and C4 (which requires being far too close for the class's role). BF1 has solved this with K Bullets, giving Scout a proper offensive damage gadget that works at the class's intended range.

In BF4, Assault had the M320, Engy had launchers, Support had the XM25, but Recon was left out. Now in BF1 Support is the one left out. I'm not happy with either situation.

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potetr

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Monday, August 29th 2016, 6:58pm

Quoted from "NoctyrneSAGA"

Quoted from "potetr"

The new versions of the tripmine will actually accomplish working as reliable area denial. Atleast the incendiary one. I think it is a clever gadget, even if it's spotted and detonated you can't run past it immediately. I wonder why they included a gas one, that seems very unreliable as many players carry gas masks.

Forcing players to hipfire while you are set up far away ADSing with a bipod seems like a really good idea.

True! Forgot if forced hipfire. I guess a gas mortar would be very useful as well then.